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Michael Saylor
You have seven and a half billion people on this planet literally living in modern day slavery. We have never lived in a global free market. If you're living in bitcoin, you're living in the start of the first global free market the world has ever seen.
Whitney Webb
A lot of these people, you know, became billionaires because they played ball with some of the worst people in the world, and they continue to do so.
Jeff Booth
Bitcoin represents a new economic protocol, a new monetary protocol. You have 5,000 years of recorded history during which humanity has functioned with defective money.
Michael Saylor
When I found bitcoin, I was in despair. The most pernicious thing you can do to someone is you make them think that they're just not smart enough. And the reason they're failing is because they're not smart and they don't work hard enough. No, the system is rigged against you.
Whitney Webb
Bitcoin will win, but not everybody's going
Michael Saylor
to win with it.
Whitney Webb
Hey, everyone.
Natalie
Welcome back to Coin Stories. I went back through some of the most viewed interviews this show has ever done. The conversations that you came back to, the ones that you shared with so many people and the ones that lit up my inbox, and I wanted to pull the moments that stuck with me and with you the most. Like Michael Saylor on why bitcoin is the most important innovation since fire. And Whitney Webb on the network that runs the show behind the scenes of everything. And Jeff Booth on the lie at the center of the system that we all live in. And Colonel Douglas MacGregor on what's actually coming for the economy. I wanted to build a story out of all of these clips because when you put them all together, when you put these four voices side by side, it really does tell a story. It starts with what's broken, and then it moves to what fixes it, and it ends with what we can all do about it. So basically, three chapters, four of the sharpest minds in this space. About three, 35 minutes or so. And I want to get into it, starting with chapter one, the problem we're starting here, because you can't fix what you won't look at.
Michael Saylor
You have seven and a half billion people on this planet literally living in modern day slavery, unaware that they're living in modern day slavery from this, from the same system. And so take seven and a half billion people out of modern day slavery and add them to the free market where they're mines and can create value for us too, and you'll have a faster rate of deflation, you'll have a faster rate of abundance for everybody.
Whitney Webb
Well and that's the whole movement towards you will own nothing and you will be happy.
Natalie
It's crazy to think about because this country was founded by revolutionaries who fought rugged individuals who fought for our freedom.
Whitney Webb
And here we are today.
Natalie
Sometimes I wonder, I mean the facts are out there.
Whitney Webb
Everybody knows they're barely keeping up with
Natalie
the cost of living.
Whitney Webb
The majority of Americans don't have enough
Natalie
for a $400 emergency assets are owned
Whitney Webb
by the, the you know, 1%.
Natalie
The majority of people can't save for retirement or pay for their kids education. But we're not seeing people out in the streets, you know, protesting and saying
Whitney Webb
we want something different, we want something better.
Natalie
People seem very complacent. Do you agree?
Joe
Yes, but I think it's back to what I said earlier. As long as the food stamps are available, as long as the government checks continue to show up and remember what is it? A third or more of our gross domestic product or gross national product is now government spending. I mean who are we kidding? So I mean as long as these things continue, not much will happen.
Michael Saylor
Yeah, it's moving denialism. And they just don't care about the world's getting worse. And they don't, they can't. But they don't understand. They haven't looked deep enough or they're in so much pain that they think that there's a solve somewhere else or somebody else's fault. And they, and that keeps them from investigating Bitcoin at a deeper level. But it's their pain that's caused. And then they go and listen to experts telling them that they should live, that should be the way that they live. Because in a monetary system has to look like that and because it sounds too confusing and people use all these big terms, qe, liquidity, this and this program, this program, but this program. And it's so confusing that they don't want they can ask the question because they feel like they're not smart enough to know the question. That's actually why I start the other side. Because if you're trying to explain the Rube Goldberg machine that is just a system in with checks and balances to keep the system solvent that that has to have more and more manipulation. It's almost impossible to chase that down to the sand because there's always another thing. There's always a hidden off balance sheet money that's, that's stolen. There's always the extra programs that are funded. There's always growth of government in, outside that system and trying to Chase it in the I know I know it because I've chased it all down. But trying to explain it from that system is ludicrous. And if you start with the natural state of the free market is deflation and if somebody go understands that then they can start to see the generation the multi generational the greatest lie we've
Natalie
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Whitney Webb
feel like that's one of the things that ultimately thankfully led me to Bitcoin because I was getting so frustrated and disillusioned and I, I didn't, I didn't know who to blame. And it was when I started to peer into how the financial system actually worked that I was like, oh, this is the root problem. It's politics and the polarization are all symptoms that are coming from it. But at the root of it really just manipulated money, broken incentives and corruption at the, at the core.
Michael Saylor
We have never lived in a global free market. You have no reference frame for what I'm talking about. No one on the planet has a reference frame for what I'm talking about. You. The way your brain will, will compare things is compare from what has existed before and then try to make an association with what the new thing is. And what's happening on, on Bitcoin is it's imposing a new set of rules and it's ruining people's reference frame. It's imposing what I just described you. Actually, if you're living in Bitcoin, you're living in the start of the first global free market the world has ever seen.
Whitney Webb
So I think what the way they want people to feel is feel overwhelmed, like they're too small and they can't do anything about it. And for them to be afraid all the time. Okay, so there are a lot of small things you can do to change things. And really, I mean, it doesn't have to necessarily be like homesteading and getting off the grid and all of that, because everyone doesn't have the financial ability to do that, especially not like, right away, you know? So, I mean, it can be something just as small as, like, being nice
Anonymous Bitcoin Advocate
to people around you or like, striking
Whitney Webb
up conversation with your neighbors. Because so many people, like, socialize online almost exclusively these days. They don't even know who their neighbors are. And if there's a crisis, you're cut
Anonymous Bitcoin Advocate
off from the Internet.
Whitney Webb
You need to know who your neighbors are and have some sort of, like, you know, commodity. I can't even talk anymore. My throat's so messed up.
Anonymous Bitcoin Advocate
You have to have some sort of
Whitney Webb
rapport with them, right? So it makes sense to just get out there in the real world. We need to be less online.
Natalie
All right, just such fascinating clips there. Chapter two. The solution. Once you see how the system actually works, the next question is what replaces it? And for that, you have to start from a completely different first principle.
Michael Saylor
Let's start in layers, right? And start at the top and again go through each one of these things. So the natural state of the free market is deflationary. As we create technology and better tools or digital goods that replace physical goods. Those goods, because the prices fall to the marginal cost of production faster, because it's based on a line of code, fall faster, even faster. So physical goods would fall less fast because there's still more human labor in. In those goods. And some. And, and so. But I'm trying to do this in an order to be able. Because it's a comp. But prices fall to the marginal cost of production. As we create more and more technology and abundance, then that means prices should fall faster and faster, meaning there is no inflation rate. There's no zero inflation rate. The natural state of the market is not zero. It's not 2%, it's not 5%. It is. It is negative. It's a productivity rate of the world expanding. And so that. That today was. Would probably be. Now, you can, you cannot measure what I'm saying from the system you're measuring from. And the chart that you just described, I hate that chart because every single thing in that chart is also manipulated by the money supply. So TVs, computers would have fallen way faster. IPhones would have been fallen way faster. The entire chart is being manipulated by money Supply and everything in it is being measured. So you have to be outside of the system to see the real truth of how fast prices are falling. That's why bitcoin is outside of the system. It's bounded by energy. It's outside of the system. So you can see the true rate of what I'm talking about.
Whitney Webb
I want to tug on something that you said because one thing that I, I'm trying to do actually as well, and I see some of the other public figures in bitcoin doing this, is when you, when you go full force combating, you know, maybe the people in power or powerful corporations, you're not, you don't, you don't get very far.
Natalie
Right.
Whitney Webb
And so I think of a quote from the 80s, Frederick Hayek, the economist who didn't, you know, bitcoin wasn't around, but he said something about like, the only way that we're going to fix the problem of, of government and money is if we introduce some things in a sly and roundabout way that they pretty much cannot stop. And I think a lot of people have hope that that is what Bitcoin is, that it's a Trojan horse that as long as the more that we almost present it in a way that's very friendly and it can assimilate perfectly into the financial system, you know, don't worry about it. Yes, oh yes, the dollar will remain global reserve currency, but ultimately, because of its decentralization and global adoption, it will sort of take over and be this neutral, not only reserve asset and all that, but currency that we can exchange value. Why do we need 160 currencies?
Natalie
Do you see that as being possible
Whitney Webb
at all that like it could Trojan horse in the solution so that we don't have to deal with all this? I mean, there will always be corruption,
Natalie
but that it won't be so easy
Whitney Webb
because when you can manipulate the money, it makes it a lot easier and more lucrative to do the horrible things that we see people doing.
Well, I think it depends on, on what happens with regulation and moving forward. Ultimately, I think it's been made very clear by the people that like it and the traditional financial system now that they only like it if it's, you know, used as digital gold and not as something transactable. They don't want to transact with it. They want it to be something that's held and again is for asset storage.
Jeff Booth
You know, Western civilization used Roman numerals for a long, long time because of the Roman Empire. And it's a very, if you've ever tried to use Roman numerals to subtract and add and divide and do math or program a computer. I don't know anybody that actually programs a computer with Roman numerals today. It's very, very challenging. But it was pretty sticky for a couple thousand years. And then at some point, Arabic numerals came along and someone said, you know, we use These numbers like 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, and it's just a lot more efficient. And here's a new notation now. Why does it take people so long? Well, because the old protocol is embedded in everything. It's embedded in the accounting, it's embedded in the law. It's embedded in everybody spent 30 years of their life learning it. And so people struggle with new protocols. And so if I come up with a new protocol which is an order of magnitude better or two orders of magnitude better, right? You have to migrate the institutions, the governments, the individuals, and oftentimes you have to have a generational shift. Bitcoin represents a new economic protocol, a new monetary protocol. So you have 5,000 years of recorded history during which humanity has functioned with defective money. And every book on economics by whether it was an Austrian economist or whether it was a fiat economist or any kind of economist or political economist or the like, every single book was written in a world where the money was mathematically defective. And it's impossible for you to appreciate the theoretical sound money or proper money until you've seen an example of one, right? You have to see one. Clean money. The Austrians, the only model they had was gold, but we knew that. But you couldn't make the argument in favor of perfected money using gold as an example, because gold actually suffered or created hyperinflation in Spain, you know, in, in the 16th century.
Unknown Bitcoin Expert
Bitcoin's digital capital, it's a revolution in the capital markets. It's a profound, you know, once in humanity, innovation, it allows us to tightly bind economic energy to the human being or to the corporation, to any entity. It's, you know, the ability to tightly bind economic energy to the individual is as profound as fire, electricity, or even the formation of fat in mammals. It's a fundamental building block of life, and it's just the basis of it. On top of that, we can create digital credit like strc. We can create something better, digital money. You can create a bank account that pays you 8%, no volatility. Right? How many people have that? Nobody. How many people want it? Everybody. What's it worth collectively? You know, conservatively $300 trillion. Okay, so there's $300 trillion of credit and everybody's got garbage credit with no yield, with awful tax treatment, with massive risk. Credit risk, duration risk, currency risk. Very difficult. So you have a world which is not served well by the 20th century Conventional finance assets and finance structures and finance ideologies and finance protocols. You have a new world, a digital world with digital protocols, digital assets, digital capital, digital credit, digital money.
Natalie
So you've now been through your first
Whitney Webb
full four year cycle. The highs, the lows.
Natalie
What's your biggest lesson that you took away from the bear market?
Jeff Booth
I think the lesson of bitcoin is Bitcoin is the best asset. There is no second best asset. Buy bitcoin, keep buying bitcoin, don't sell the bitcoin. Ignore the noise.
Whitney Webb
Were there any moments though, I mean, when it was plummeting down, a lot of people thought it would go below 10,000. That anything made you a little nervous,
Natalie
you wish you had waited to buy some of it?
Jeff Booth
No. The truth is other people with, with either less information or, or less awareness, they. If someone studies bitcoin for an hour, then they will watch the News for, for 1,000 days and they will have 87 moments of anxiety during which they'll sell the bitcoin. And so bitcoin has a lot of those people, like they heard someone say buy it and then they buy it. But if you would buy it because someone said it's a good idea, then you would sell it because someone said it was a bad idea. Because you're not making your own decision. You're basically reacting to the crowd or sentiment or emotion. So a lot of people make investments based upon a recommendation from somebody else. And in the non bitcoin world, that's almost essential because there's 10,000 stocks most people don't study. How many people spend 100 hours studying each of the S&P 500 stocks? Nobody.
Natalie
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Michael Saylor
If people ever recapitalize their sovereign debt with bitcoin, it will be a benefit to the American people, the American corporations, the American way of life, the American ideology. And it's a way out. Like we talked about, Natalie, we've talked about the despair of the working class that can't get ahead and the hope that bitcoin brings to the working class. An individual or family can buy bitcoin. Oftentimes we don't really empathize with the despair of a corporation or the despair of a bank. Sometimes we don't really empathize with. But what about the despair of a bank which has capitalized on a collapsing asset capital? What about the despair of a corporation? 1% of the companies in the S&P 500 make all the money. The others work hard. When I found bitcoin, I was in despair. I had worked for a decade. I had spent 20,000 man years attempting to do everything under the sun. I could not get ahead. And I was the same me, I wasn't stupid, right? You look at me and say, well, this is Michael Saylor, worked as hard as he could for, for a decade and could not get ahead, right? And the most pernicious thing you can do to Someone is. You make them think that they're just not smart enough. And the reason they're failing is because they're not smart and they don't work hard enough. And then you realize, no, the system is rigged against you. So what does this mean? What does the strategic Bitcoin reserve mean? It means that Bitcoin is hope for the people. But it means that we, once the United States embraces Bitcoin as the world's reserve capital network and it builds that strategic Bitcoin reserve. The path is open for corporations in the United States to recapitalize on Bitcoin and the path is open for banks to recapitalize on Bitcoin. And now corporations don't have to die. Banks don't have to die.
I try to simplify things and I say if, if Bitcoin fails as a medium of exchange, it will fail as a currency, as a store of value, just as a simple. And here's the thing, I know Bitcoin will not fail as a medium of exchange. And so how I look at, and, and I can totally appreciate somebody wanting to attract more Bitcoin and measure in, in the US Dollar and, and leverage against that. And I, and I realize most people pricing in Bitcoin or pricing in the US Dollar are actually through that action because they're not holding their own Bitcoin. They're, they're not spending in Bitcoin. They're hold, they're holding it as a store of value only and they're pricing it in the US Dollar. They're essentially a trader, right? And one day they're going to sell their Bitcoin for something else into, in, in the measured in US Dollars. And, and that's okay, it's going to happen anyways. But these two systems are incompatible, right? We've already determined the natural state of the free market is deflation and the US Based system is inflationary. So the inflationary system has to centralize whether it attracts more Bitcoin on its balance sheet and, or in BlackRock's balance sheet or in microstrategy or anything else. It has to rely and over time if it, if it centralizes more and more and more and, and people, let's just use again two opposite ends of the spectrum and then we can, we don't have to yell at different people inside and, but let's just go from, from first principles. If you have an inflationary system against productivity growth in the world, it has to eventually manipulate money. It has to centralize.
There's 8 billion people on the planet, and there's 7.7 billion people that live in a place which is less, that's managed much less intelligently than the United States. So the loser, the losers are the authoritarians and the authorities that wish to impose a fiat currency on the 7.7 billion people that is more inflationary than the dollar. And while they're doing it, they will impose a fiat capital asset on the same 7 billion people. So, you know, we say, well, everybody should just use Bitcoin. Well, they should use Bitcoin. But the truth of the matter is, if you were an operating business in Argentina for the past 20 years and you had 100 million pesos, if you had been able to swap it for $100 million on a digital currency network, you would still be rich. And if you had been stuck in the peso, you would have been devalued 1001 and you would be impoverished. And if you had bought bitcoin, well,
Jeff Booth
yeah, you would be like the richest
Michael Saylor
person in the world, right? I mean, if you had bought $100 million of Bitcoin 20 years ago, I
Unknown Bitcoin Expert
mean, you couldn't, but 10 years ago,
Michael Saylor
yeah, you would be richer than Elon Musk. But the point is, and this is what I learned in my life, don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good. And the message of the crypto renaissance to the bitcoiners would be, yeah, bitcoin is like a perfect solution. But the Argentinians didn't need the perfect solution. If they'd all picked the perfect solution, they'd be richer than Elon Musk and Bernard Arnault and, and Jeff Bezos. Right now, they didn't need that. They just needed a solution that was better than an awful one. And so in this particular case, a digital currency that spreads to the entire world, that's embraced by the world, would actually provide American prosperity to people in Africa, Asia, South America, asean, Europe. And it would be a, I'm going
Jeff Booth
to call it a gateway drug.
Michael Saylor
Right, to Bitcoin. Right. I think that when you're in Nigeria going to tether, going to a digital currency that's backed by the US Dollar is the obvious step. And after you get there, the next step would be go to digital cat capital, which is Bitcoin.
Unknown Bitcoin Expert
There's a natural process of taking, taking innovative technology, building it into a consumer device or an industrial device. Right. And, and then having enough of a track record that people are willing to bet their life or their, or their reputation on it. And I Think we're in that process, commercialization now.
Natalie
That's fair. So before your final thoughts, I just was curious. You don't seem bothered at all by cost basis and a lot of people right now are trying to find the bottom and obviously a lot of people are looking at the technical charts, but
Whitney Webb
you just seem unfazed. You're just buying at any price. Can you sort of address that for those especially who are like, well, if maybe you think it's going to go lower, why not accumulate at a lower cost basis?
Unknown Bitcoin Expert
Well, you could think of us as dollar cost averaging, but the key point is we're using equity, we're not taking out a loan. Okay. So when we're buying bitcoin, if we sell equity and then we buy bitcoin, then we bought the Bitcoin at 100,000 a coin. If we buy the Bitcoin at 200,000 a coin, by selling equity, we're simply swapping. We're doing a perpetual risk free swap. We're swapping equity for bitcoin. Right. When should you swap equity for bitcoin? Whenever it's accretive. Right. If, if bitcoin traded up 10% but our equity traded up 25%, then it's accretive. It's profitable to swap the equity for the bitcoin. If bitcoin then trades down 20%, are you glad you did it? Sure are. Because you wouldn't have had the bitcoin otherwise.
Natalie
And finally, chapter three, the path forward. Because the technology working isn't the whole story. No politician is coming to save us. No billionaire is either. So what's left? You and me,
Joe
people, normal people who just love the country and care about it, who have no special agenda other than their country and saving it. We've got to bring you to Washington and put you in, into the appointed positions and the elected positions. All of these things have to happen. People kind of look at me and say, geez, that's pretty radical. Well, that's what Andrew Jackson did. And these things have happened before. It's just that we haven't had as bad a situation economically in the past as we have today. But we've got to have people lined up, people that we say, okay, Joe, you live in northern Alabama and Betty, you're in Montana. You're solid people. We're going to put you into these jobs right now in Washington. We got to do it. And what they have to do is be loyal to the country first and foremost. First your country, then everything else.
Natalie
And we need to fix the money. We can't have this monopoly and we need to stop all the money printing. I'm actually very grateful that we have
Whitney Webb
something like Bitcoin that can provide a
Natalie
peaceful transition so that maybe we can
Whitney Webb
avoid a seismic, you know, just terrible deflationary bust and collapse that, that would really hurt a lot of people. People start, can start to slowly allocate to something like Bitcoin and there's nothing more American really. I mean, think of the principles that it stands for. Freedom, individualism, personal responsibility, self sovereignty, which is why I'm, I'm so passionate about it.
Natalie
And I'm glad you are too.
Anonymous Bitcoin Advocate
So like, some people hear this stuff and get black pilled and worried, but like instead get excited and let's go out and build some stuff so we don't have to use these crazy people's tools and we can just use our own tools, you know, and much better tools at that that like actually work for the people and are made by people for people, you know, and not like made by oligarchs to force people to serve the oligarchs. You know, let's not do that. Like, let's get excited about building something new and better. Instead of being like all black pilled and depressed. We can do stuff about it. We just have to like, get out of the armchair and like start building. And that's like what humans are meant to do. Get out and do and build stuff. We're not meant to like sit, you know, in a, on our couch with a VR headset on and just like be like that all day. Like no, we're supposed to get up and like build stuff and make things and create. That's what humans are supposed to do. So instead of being like cognitively diminished by like the Kissinger Schmidt AI and sitting there with your like Oculus Facebook headset on, let's go out and build real stuff and real tools and like, you know, use Bitcoin for financial freedom like it's supposed to be. And all these other, like, this technology doesn't have to be bad. It can, but we have to get out and build it ourselves. And there's people that can do that and there's people in the space that can be supported to do that if you don't know how to do that. So let's go.
Whitney Webb
A lot of these billionaires, including in Silicon Valley, would not have become the billionaires they are if it wasn't for either government contracts or contract with some of these big players in the, you know, the cartel landscape of US, Corporate America. So a lot of these people, you know, became billionaires because they played ball with some of the worst people in the world, and they continue to do so. So, you know, again, I. I guess the common theme here is to not be naive, to be vigilant, and to perhaps distrust billionaires just a little bit more and spend a lot more time, you know, in your local community and, and with people who matter to you and thinking about how we're going to opt out of these policies that everyone in politics is going to try and impose on us one way or another, and how we're going to, you know, get through that as a community, because all of these things, digital id, programmable, surveillable money, it's not going to happen if people don't use them.
Right?
And so they have to frame it as voluntary. They have to create all these situations where we feel pressured to acquiesce, and we do acquiesce, and we need to be proactive about thinking how to not acquiesce. Because if we don't acquiesce and enough people opt out, the it fails.
My last question is just where do you. Where do you get your bravery?
Natalie
Where does your bravery come from?
Whitney Webb
Well, thanks.
Anonymous Bitcoin Advocate
I don't really see it as bravery.
Whitney Webb
I see it as a necessity because,
Anonymous Bitcoin Advocate
you know, I don't want to live in the system that's being created. And, you know, I have an ability, I. I guess to put information together in a narrative, in. In a way with sourcing and all of that that people can find compelling to help us figure out what type of situation we're actually in. Because until we have a full understanding
Whitney Webb
of that, it's very hard to understand
Anonymous Bitcoin Advocate
how to get out of it, you know, so, you know, I just don't really see any other alternative, you know,
Whitney Webb
because they're taking everything from everyone, like, everything that matters.
Anonymous Bitcoin Advocate
So, like, why would you not do
Whitney Webb
something to fight back?
Jeff Booth
My advice to anybody is figure out what your predisposition and capabilities are, then choose where you're going to apply yourself. If it's the piano and you're Beethoven, then something great will come out of it. But you had to have the piano. And if Beethoven had been born a thousand years earlier, he wouldn't have written those piano concertos. You wouldn't be remembering him the same way. So I think everybody has the choice, and you have to decide what do you want to focus on. And there's a world of opportunity today. It's all your fingertips. If you go on YouTube, you want to master AI art generation or AI video generation or programming? Or do you want to learn how to build lightning applications? Or you want to master Bitcoin? Bitcoin as money? Or do you want to study cyber security? Right. And. And you know, there's no doubt some people have a natural talent and they develop. Magnus Carlsen was a better chess player, you know, at age 11, than I would be if I spent my entire life, 3,000 hours a year playing chess. And it's pretty obvious to me I'm just never going to be that good. But. But I don't dwell on the fact that there's a better musician or a better chess player than me. I just focus upon what is my highest, best purpose in life, how do I achieve my full potential. And my advice to anybody is figure out what you love. Figure out what the world needs. Hopefully find an intersection between what the world needs and what you love, because you get paid for that. And then focus on that. And don't spend a lot of time lamenting the fact that you don't play golf or basketball or chess or music as good as somebody else. There's always a bigger, better deal somewhere. And the Internet proves that. You ought to just your real worry ought to be that you get distracted by a hundred different things that are all exciting and interesting good ideas, because the world is really good at serving you up. 10 other things to do in addition to the thing you're currently doing. So I would figure out what you can do, what the world needs you to do, laser, like into that thing. Don't get distracted on that thing. You will achieve your full potential, whatever that would be. And it'll probably be 10x what you would have achieved, or 100x or a thousandx what you would have achieved if you just kind of took a cavalier attitude toward everything.
Michael Saylor
Bitcoin will win, but not everybody's gonna win with it.
Whitney Webb
Okay, well, that sounds like a warning as well as advice.
Natalie
Thanks so much for checking out this episode of Coin Stories. If you haven't already, please subscribe to the show and turn on those notifications so you never miss new content. This show is for educational and entertainment purposes only. Nothing should constitute as official investment advice. And you should always do your own research. My inbox is open. If you want to share feedback or guest suggestions, just reach out to us at info at talkingbitcoin. Com. We'll see you next time.
In this special episode, journalist and educator Natalie Brunell curates the most compelling moments from Coin Stories’ all-time most-watched interviews with Michael Saylor, Whitney Webb, Jeff Booth, and Colonel Douglas MacGregor. Through a narrative that unfolds in three “chapters” — The Problem, The Solution, The Path Forward — the episode explores the flaws of today’s monetary system, the revolutionary promise of Bitcoin, and why personal and community action remain essential, even as technology transforms finance.
Modern Financial Slavery and Denial
“You have seven and a half billion people on this planet literally living in modern day slavery, unaware that they're living in modern day slavery from the same system.” [02:06]
Wealth Concentration & Complacency
“A lot of these people...became billionaires because they played ball with some of the worst people in the world, and they continue to do so.” [00:12], [31:34]
“As long as the food stamps are available, as long as the government checks continue to show up...not much will happen.” [03:19]
The Lie at the Center
“They use all these big terms...it's so confusing that they don't want...to ask the question because they feel like they're not smart enough to know the question.” [04:08]
Root Causes of Dysfunction
“At the root of it [are] really just manipulated money, broken incentives and corruption at the core.” [06:21]
Free Market Deflation vs. Artificial Inflation
“The natural state of the free market is deflationary...as we create more and more technology and abundance, [prices] should fall faster and faster.” – Booth [08:38] “That's why Bitcoin is outside of the system. It's bounded by energy. It's outside of the system. So you can see the true rate of what I'm talking about.” – Booth [09:46]
Bitcoin as a Trojan Horse
“The only way that we're going to fix the problem of government and money is if we introduce some things in a sly and roundabout way that they pretty much cannot stop. And I think a lot of people have hope that that is what Bitcoin is, that it's a Trojan horse...” [10:52]
Adoption Hurdles and Protocol Change
“Western civilization used Roman numerals for a long, long time...it’s pretty sticky for a couple thousand years. And then...Arabic numerals came along...It's a lot more efficient...But the old protocol is embedded in everything...So people struggle with new protocols.” [12:27]
Digital Capital Revolution
“Bitcoin's digital capital, it's a revolution in the capital markets. It's a profound...once-in-humanity innovation. It allows us to tightly bind economic energy to the human being or...entity. It’s as profound as fire, electricity, or even the formation of fat in mammals.” [14:45]
Investing Mindset & Resilience
“Bitcoin is the best asset. There is no second best asset. Buy bitcoin, keep buying bitcoin, don't sell the bitcoin. Ignore the noise.” [16:33]
Hope for the Working Class
“When I found bitcoin, I was in despair...the most pernicious thing you can do to someone is...make them think that they're just not smart enough...And then you realize, no, the system is rigged against you.” [19:54]
Transition vs. Perfection
“Don’t let the perfect be the enemy of the good...the Argentinians didn’t need the perfect solution. They...just needed a solution that was better than an awful one.” [25:14]
Leadership and Civic Duty
“We've got to bring you to Washington and put you into the appointed positions and the elected positions...First your country, then everything else.” [28:39]
Peaceful Transition & American Principles
“We need to fix the money. We can't have this monopoly and we need to stop all the money printing. I'm actually very grateful that we have something like Bitcoin that can provide a peaceful transition...” – Natalie & Webb [29:33–29:45] “There's nothing more American really...Freedom, individualism, personal responsibility, self sovereignty, which is why I'm, I'm so passionate about it.” – Webb [29:45]
Community, Building, and Resilience
“Instead get excited and let's go out and build some stuff...not like made by oligarchs to force people to serve the oligarchs...let's get excited about building something new and better.” [30:11] “We can do stuff about it. We just have to like, get out of the armchair and like start building. And that's like what humans are meant to do.” [30:28]
On Billionaires and Power
“A lot of these billionaires...would not have become...billionaires...if it wasn't for either government contracts or...the cartel landscape of US, Corporate America...to not be naive, to be vigilant, and to perhaps distrust billionaires just a little bit more and spend a lot more time...in your local community...” [31:34]
Collective Resistance
“They have to frame it as voluntary. They have to create all these situations where we feel pressured to acquiesce...we need to be proactive about thinking how to not acquiesce.” [32:37–32:53]
Finding Bravery and Purpose
On where courage comes from, Webb responds:
“I see it as a necessity because...I don't want to live in the system that's being created...I just don't really see any other alternative, you know...because they're taking everything from everyone, everything that matters.” [32:58–33:36]
Booth’s parting advice:
“Figure out what your predisposition and capabilities are, then choose where you're going to apply yourself...figure out what the world needs...find an intersection between what the world needs and what you love...” [33:38]
Final Words: Hope and Warning
“Bitcoin will win, but not everybody's gonna win with it.” [36:24]
"That sounds like a warning as well as advice." [36:30]
Michael Saylor:
“We have never lived in a global free market.” [06:48, 00:00]
“Bitcoin is hope for the people.” [19:54]
“Bitcoin will win, but not everybody's gonna win with it.” [36:24]
Whitney Webb:
“At the root of it [are] really just manipulated money, broken incentives and corruption at the core.” [06:21]
“Not everybody is going to win with it.” [00:48]
“To not be naive, to be vigilant, and to perhaps distrust billionaires just a little bit more...” [31:34]
Jeff Booth:
“Bitcoin is the best asset. There is no second best asset. Buy bitcoin, keep buying bitcoin, don't sell the bitcoin. Ignore the noise.” [16:33]
“If someone studies bitcoin for an hour, then they will watch the News for 1,000 days and they will have 87 moments of anxiety during which they'll sell the bitcoin.” [17:00]
This episode is a must-listen for anyone seeking to understand the problems at the heart of the current financial order, the radical promise of Bitcoin, and why collective effort and individual action remain as crucial as ever.