Broadway legend André De Shields doesn't walk, he floats

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Terry Gross

This is FRESH Air. I'm Terry Gross. When Andre de Shields name is mentioned, it's often preceded by the words Broadway legend or the great. He won a Tony for his performance in the musical Hadestown in 2019, and the show won seven other Tonys, including best musical. Stars of the original Broadway cast, including de Shields, reunited for a revival of the show last year in London. That production was filmed and will be released in theaters on Friday. Right now, de Shields is one of the stars of Cats, the Jellicle Ball, which won three Tonys last month. It uses the same songs as Cats but with different beats and is set in the queer underground ballroom culture of the 80s. That show is closing August 8th. De Shields is especially remarkable considering he's 80 and has been HIV positive since 1991. He grew up in Baltimore in what he describes as the innermost part of Baltimore's inner city, and figured getting an education would be key to getting out. He earned his BA In English Literature at the University of Wisconsin in Madison and and an MA In African American Studies from nyu. He started his career in experimental theater in Chicago. When his theater group performed in New York, he decided to stay. He soon got cast as the wizard in the 1975 original Broadway cast of the Wiz, which was produced a few years before the movie. He was nominated for a Tony for his performance in the show Ain't Misbehavin, which was built around music associated with Fats Waller, and he won an Emmy when it was produced for a 1982 NBC broadcast. He was nominated for another Tony for his performance in the Full Monty. He's performed in a wide range of dramas, including King Lear, Waiting for Godot and Death of a Salesman. Let's start with Andre de Shields singing the opening number of Hadestown, in which he sets up the story and introduces the characters. The show tells a version of the Greek myths about Hades, Hermes, Orpheus and Eurydice. De Shields plays Hermes, the God who escorts the souls of the dead to the underworld, which is ruled by Hades. Here's de Shields from the original Broadway cast recording.

Andre de Shields

Chugga chugga chugga ch ch ch

Musical Performances

Once upon a time there was a railroad line Don't I swear brother, don't I swear. It was the road to hell. It was hard times, it was a world of gods, An old tale from way back when. It's an old sound. It's an old sound. And we're gonna sing it again.

Terry Gross

Andre de Shields, welcome to FRESH air. Congratulations on all the things that you're doing now. I just think it's great. Did you ever believe that despite having being diagnosed with HIV in 1991 and believing that you had a considerably before that, but you just didn't have the diagnosis that you'd not only live to see age 80, but that you'd be in a new film version of a musical you'd won a Tony for? And at the same time, you'd be on Broadway as one of the stars of Cat's the Jellicle Ball?

Andre de Shields

The answer to that question is yes,

Terry Gross

and my answer to that is no.

Andre de Shields

I believed from my very first conscious thought that my destiny would rise up and meet me. So when my mother shared with me that her lifelong dream had been to be a chorus girl, and that was the term she used, she didn't say dancer, she said chorus girl. And my father shared with me that he had always wanted to be a singer. He had a beautiful tenor voice, but the closest he got to that dream coming true was to sing in the church choir. Those two bits of knowledge only reaffirmed what I had been dreaming about since the day I was born. I wanted to sing. I wanted to dance. Now I can look at it and understand. Oh. Oh, wow. It's been bequeathed to me by those X and Y chromosomes that was responsible for my conception.

Terry Gross

HIV, when you had it in 91, it was a death sentence. You had two partners who died of AIDS and friends as well, cast members who you work with. So you really thought you were going to be on Broadway at the age of 80?

Andre de Shields

I didn't think I was going to be on Broadway at the age of 80. But I did know that I would be alive, and I did know that I would continue on my path. And I had already, in 1980, before there was an acronym HIV, that I had had an infection of my lymph nodes. And not any one of three doctors on two continents could answer the question, what is this? Now, in 1979, when I had gone to London for the first time to perform in Ain't Misbehavin, there was already a friend of mine who, who caught a cold, and three days later he was dead. So the mystery was already in the air. How can someone die from a cold? There's something going on that nobody understands. So when my lymph nodes blew up in 1980, in Los Angeles on the tour of Ain't Misbehavin. I clocked it immediately. Whatever that mystery is, I'm beginning to decode it. I'm beginning to understand it.

Terry Gross

Wait, so you were symptomatic for 11 years before you were diagnosed?

Andre de Shields

Yes.

Terry Gross

It's a long time.

Andre de Shields

And when I finally got the clinical diagnosis, I had 16 T cells. So I was near death, but I knew I wasn't going to die.

Terry Gross

Wow. You know, Hadestown is about the souls of the dead. So seeing Hadestown made me think about the stories that human beings have told themselves over the centuries, about why we are living and why we die. And the Greek myths are early examples of that. When you did Hadestown, when you were performing in it, and when you went back, which I imagine you did, to read the myth that Hadestown draws on, didn't it make you think about that? That the stories we've told ourselves, about what happens after we die, how they've changed over time?

Andre de Shields

I did exactly that. And I also. There's an African proverb which is based on a bird, and the bird is called a sankofa. It's a flightless bird, and it is known to walk deliberately forward, but every once in a while, it looks over its shoulder. The lesson there is, if you do not know where you're coming from, where you've been, you can't possibly know where you're headed, where you're going. And when I was asked to embody the role of Hermes, not only did that proverb come to mind, but all of the close calls that I had experienced in my life came to mind, and I felt prepared to take on this role. Hermes is the creature that accompanies humans when they have to cross the River Styx to visit in Hades. You can't get there if Hermes does not accompany you.

Terry Gross

How have you changed how you can perform on stage at the age of 80? No one is as limber, but you still move with such grace.

Andre de Shields

You're absolutely correct about what we think about the human body and the human spirit. Let's talk about the physical part of that. Yes, Mr. Arthur has visited me. I've got arthritis. My knees are compromised, my joints ache. But I've got a doctor. His name is Dr. Footlights. Her name. Her name is Dr. Footlights. And when I stand on that stage and when those lights come up and when the audience greets me, the pain disappears.

Terry Gross

So I want to ask you about cats. The Jellicle Ball. It's set in the queer ballroom culture where there are drag Competitions in different categories relating to like, singing, dance, costumes. Were you a part of that at all, either as a participant or an observer?

Andre de Shields

I was not a part of the ball culture as we know it here in New York and we give it a birth decade of the 80s. But I did know a phenomenon called the Jewel Box Review and it toured the chitlin circuit. I'm talking about the middle to late 50s, in the last century.

Terry Gross

And the chitlin circuit was like a circuit of like black theaters. Started like in the vaudeville era, I think.

Andre de Shields

Exactly. And in Baltimore, the theater was called the Royal. And of course, in the 60s, urban renewal raised it and the cultural spine of the city died. However, I was able to see entertainment like my first Motown Review at the Royal. I was able to see Moms Mabley at the Royal. I was able to see Flip Wilson at the Royal. I was also able to see the Jewel Box Revue, which was a company of men who dressed as women. And they were gorgeous. At that time they were called transvestites, which comes from, I think, the French word le travastie. But it's all about the idea that life is never what you think it is. Nothing is what it seems to be. And seeing the Jewel Box Review was part of my education as an entertainer.

Terry Gross

What did it mean to you, seeing people who were drag performers?

Andre de Shields

It meant that fantasy had to be in my toolbox. It meant that what we do in our actual lives is what I, as a performer must do on the stage. I must fool people. I must. I must pretend. The ancient Greek word for actor means hypocrite. We must tell a lie in order to get through the 24 hour drudgery of each day.

Terry Gross

Did seeing drag performers add to your desire and ability to dress in very non conforming ways, with bright colors and short shorts, walking the streets of Manhattan? You talked about how people would kind of walk in the opposite direct, because you were so outstanding looking that it was kind of almost scary to some people.

Andre de Shields

Yes, yes.

Terry Gross

Like so eccentric looking. Did that contribute to you feeling that you wanted to and were able to wear whatever you wanted to and call attention to yourself in a very colorful and fashionable way? Original.

Andre de Shields

Exactly. Yeah, exactly. But not. Terry, you and I have only spoken for a few minutes and we don't really know one another. But I'll bet you already know that I like to wax poetic. And wearing bright colors and saying, pay attention to me, even to the point of deliberately slowing my gait. I don't rush anywhere. I walk slowly. My reputation is that Andre De Shields doesn't walk. He floats now. But this is because each of us, if we want to do something as commonplace as be happy, and if we want to do something as exceptional as being called a legend, then one really must commit to being his best self.

Terry Gross

What are some of the things you've seen change on Broadway over the years? Cause you started on Broadway in the 70s and also as a black actor. There aren't necessarily a whole lot of opportunities now either for black actors, but there's more than there were. Yet you managed to be in two of the shows with black cast, Ain't Misbehavin and the Wiz.

Andre de Shields

Well, you've explained it in a nutshell. In the early 70s, Broadway was an inhospitable terrain for black actors and black audiences. And with the advent of the Wiz, that all changed. Part of the change had to do with the decision by the producer, Ken Harper, to take some of the money and invest it in live action TV commercials so that we could lean into the living room and speak to our brethren who were sitting on the couch and say to them, don't sit there and become a couch potato. There's something that represents you playing on Broadway. You no longer have any reason to avoid it. You have a reason to come and become part of it. So the Wiz opened that door for the growth of a black audience on Broadway and an invitation to black artist to perform on Broadway. And we took that lesson from the brilliant film that starred Judy Garland, the Wizard of Oz. But I certainly identified with her huge vulnerability, which made her a tremendous lesson in how to get an audience of people to pay attention. Now, that storyline was the exclusive world of white actors and white audiences. But the magic that Ken Harper brought to the production was to take that line of truth out of Dorothy's mouth, which is, there's no place like home, and put it in the mouth of a little colored girl who sang in her church's choir. And once you do that, then it becomes universal, and that is what the Wiz should be remembered for.

Terry Gross

Your father, who wanted to be a singer, sang in church. How churchy was your family? And was that your first stage?

Andre de Shields

The family wasn't very churchy, but they were pious people. They read their Bibles on a daily basis and everyone prayed for me. And I didn't have to wonder why. I knew that I was the blackest of the black sheep in the family. And my mother particularly would take me to revival meetings and when the preacher would ask for people to come down to the makeshift pulpit, people who wanted to know Jesus. My mother would always look at me and that was encouragement enough. And I would go down and I would get on my knees and I would, in quotes, accept Christ as my savior. Not only did it please the preacher, but it pleased my mother.

Terry Gross

But it wasn't real.

Andre de Shields

Oh, of course not. And I'm not making fun of it. I'm just saying I was being a good child. I was pleasing my mother. But I knew I wanted to sing the devil's music. I wanted to go rip roaring through life, not cast caution to the wind, but have a great time being myself.

Terry Gross

Well, we need to take a break here, so let's continue this very soon. If you're just joining us, my guest is Andre de Shields, and he won a Tony for his performance in the musical Hadestown. He plays the role again in the new movie of the show, which opens Friday. He's currently on Broadway in Cat's the Jellicle Ball. We'll continue our interview after a short break. I'm Terry Gross, and this is FRESH air.

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Terry Gross

Iran, Lebanon, Israel, Gaza. With conflict unfolding in so many places, firsthand reporting has never mattered more. NPR supporters power that work. They make it possible for our journalists to go where news is happening. And supporters get perks for NPR podcasts, things like bonus episodes, archive access and more. You can sign up@plus.npr.org this is FRESH AIR. I'm Terry Gross. Let's get back to my interview with Andre de Shields. He won a Tony for his performance in the musical Hadestown. He plays the role again in a new movie of the show, which opens Friday. He's currently on Broadway in the Jellicle ball, which closes Aug. 8. He played the wizard in the original Broadway cast of the Wiz. He was nominated for Tonys for his performances in the Fats Waller musical Ain't Misbehavin' and The musical adaptation of the film the Full Monty. Your parents both wanted to be in showbiz. Your mother a chorus girl, your father a singer. And you felt that you kind of inherited their dreams that they couldn't fulfill, and you fulfilled them. But what was their reaction when they learned that you were really serious about being a performer? Did they encourage you?

Andre de Shields

Ultimately, I was encouraged in the beginning when people would ask me, andre, what do you want to. What are you going to do when you grow up? And my response was, I'm going to be a star. And they looked at me as if I had two heads. And then I managed to leave the neighborhood and be the first of that community to attend college. And they started to believe that I was a miracle maker. And while I was a junior in college, the head of the drama department came to me and said, are you in the drama department? I said, no, I'm studying English. Why you do want to know? He said, well, I think this campus would benefit from a production of Lorraine Hansberry's Raisin in the Sun. But there aren't enough black students, let alone in the drama department, for me to do this. But I can do it by inviting people from the town to join us. I just can't find the boy to play Walter Lee Younger, and I would like you to do that now. All my young life, I kept close to my vest that I wanted to be an actor. And here was the blessing being offered to me. So members of my family took the bus all the way out to Wilmington, Ohio. Not the entire family, but enough of the family to see me, at the age of 19, perform as vaulted Younger in A Raisin in the Sun. And that's when it happened. Wow, Andre, you really have talent. And then the support began to grow.

Terry Gross

What do you think the drama teacher saw in you that made him or her realized that you belonged on stage?

Andre de Shields

First of all, he saw a black male student. Second of all, he saw a young man who carried himself as if he were a king, which I still do. My mission, my journey, is to discover the throne to which I know I am heir. So that's what I carry in my mind, in my heart, and in my viscera as I walked on the quad when I was 19 years old at Wilmington College in Ohio. And that drama teacher, he witnessed the drama, and he knew this young man had it in him to play Walter Lee Younger, who had the hugest chip on his shoulder. Walter Lee Younger as the character in Raisin in the sun. And at 19, by playing that character, I was Able to dissolve the chip that was on my shoulder.

Terry Gross

What was the chip that was on your shoulder?

Andre de Shields

I'm a black man, and I'm tired of being taken advantage of. You did this to me. I can't get anywhere, and it's your fault. That's the chip. I can get anywhere I want, and it's my doing.

Terry Gross

And what dissolved that ship was embodying a character who couldn't get rid of.

Andre de Shields

Exactly.

Terry Gross

Couldn't get rid of him.

Andre de Shields

I mean, that's. Yes.

Terry Gross

And seeing how that hurt him.

Andre de Shields

Exactly. That's essential to Raisin. And the son, Walter Lee Younger, who's supposed to be the man of the family, blames everything on Mr. Whitey. And the mother says to him, oh, stop.

Terry Gross

One of the people who inspired you to become a performer and made you think maybe you could really do it was John Bubbles. When you saw him in the 1943 musical film Cabin in the sky, which has such an incredible cast. It's like Ethel Waters, Lena Horne, Louis Armstrong, the Duke Ellington Orchestra, and John

Andre de Shields

Bubbles, Eddie Rochester Anderson, whom we all

Terry Gross

know from the Jack Benny Show. Yeah. Yeah. So let me play a little bit of John Bubbles from that film, and then we'll talk about what this meant to you. And in this film, he's in a nightclub and the Duke Ellington Orchestra is backing him up. He walks in, like, really dapper, like, elegant suit. He has a cane, kind of like Fred Astaire when he was dancing. And everybody's, like, admiring him. And then he breaks out into song.

Musical Performances

I got my shirt from a silver lining I got my cane from an old oak tree and that is just the reason why the folks all nickname me Just me Cause my Haz Gurley and because my teeth are pearly and just because I always wear smiles and suits to dress up in the latest style Gee, I'm glad I'm living why take troubles all with a smile Just because my colors shade Or a wee bit different maybe that's why they call me shy.

Terry Gross

So listening back to that Andre de Shields, what memories does it bring back? And how did it inspire you?

Andre de Shields

Now, Terry Gross. This is why, among radio journalists, you are the goddess.

Terry Gross

Oh, thank you.

Andre de Shields

Because that song Shine, which is a race song, was my audition song when I came to New York. It's how I got the whiz. It's how I got Ain't Misbehavin.

Terry Gross

Really? This is what you say?

Andre de Shields

Yes. And only recently have I. I didn't stop using it, but I don't need it any longer because now people Know who Andre de Shields is.

Terry Gross

Why did you choose it and what do you think of the lyric?

Andre de Shields

I chose it because of the lyrics. Now, you played from, like, the middle of the song.

Terry Gross

Yes, because I wanted some of the slower part and some of the faster part where the tempo comes up.

Andre de Shields

But the song opens with a note that John Bubbles sings, and it's as if he's never going to stop hitting that note. And you are amazed by this man singing this long tenor note. And just at the moment when you think he's going to stop, he goes into what is essentially his biography. And I thought, wow, that's exactly what I need. Another tool in my toolbox.

Terry Gross

There's a song, and I'm trying to think of which one it is, where you hold a note excessively long.

Andre de Shields

Well, have you seen Cat's the Jellicoe Ball? When I make my entrance as old Deuteronomy, I sustain a note. And I know this because people have timed it for 44 seconds.

Musical Performances

Whoa.

Terry Gross

That's a long time.

Andre de Shields

That's a long time. But I learned that from John Bubbles from watching Cabin in the sky in the darkened atmosphere of the Royal Theater, where the chitlin circuit would visit. Every performance in Cabin in the sky was superlative, and Vincent Minnelli knew that, which is why these folks were cast, because they were the best. Vincent Minnelli? Yes. Judy Garland's husband, the father of Liza Minnelli. Do you see the connection, the great vulnerability from Judy Garland, which she gave to Liza Minnelli, who is the daughter of Vincent Minnelli, who directed the film that circumcised my heart?

Terry Gross

Yeah, Nice connection. I mean. I mean, it's an interesting connection. I've never heard somebody say, circumcise my heart. Just thinking about that for a minute,

Andre de Shields

but you know what I mean, don't you?

Terry Gross

I do, yeah.

Andre de Shields

Take away that which is unnecessary and leave you with the gold do you

Terry Gross

still sing that song? And would you maybe want to sing it for us now?

Andre de Shields

Oh, yes. Yes. You're making a black man blush right now. I know you can't see it.

Terry Gross

Whenever you're ready.

Musical Performances

What is there about me?

Andre de Shields

That what is there about you? What makes me feel well dressed Whatever that is, that's what you is the same old clothes Shoes and hat the

Musical Performances

same old thing

Andre de Shields

Rearrange oh, it's very

Musical Performances

plain to see Just how this happened to be I put some polish on

Andre de Shields

my sky piece I turned my shoestring

Musical Performances

into a tie I cut the corners off the edge of my coat so they wouldn't fly. I got my smile from a silver lining. I got my cane from an old oak tree. And that is just the reason why they called me Shine.

Terry Gross

You have a powerful voice and you sang the part that we didn't play at the beginning.

Musical Performances

Right.

Terry Gross

That was the part that you were talking about. So I'm really glad you did that. My guest is Andre de Shields. He's currently on Broadway in the Jellicle Ball and in the film version of the musical Hadestown, which will be in movie theaters this Friday. More after a break. This is FRESH air.

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Terry Gross

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Terry Gross

This is FRESH air. Let's get back to my interview with Andre de Shields. He won a Tony for his performance in the musical Hadestown. He plays the role again in a new movie of the show, which opens Friday. And he's currently on Broadway in Cat's the Jellicle Ball. So when you started in theater, it was experimental theater. The theater company performed in New York. You decided to stay and then you got the role in the Wiz as the wizard of Oz. That's incredible that you got such an important part so quickly. And the timing was perfect because it was like a black cast and there weren't many black actors on stage. So, like, what an incredible door to open for you at exactly the right time.

Andre de Shields

Exactly.

Terry Gross

And you literally begged for the chance to audition for the Wiz.

Andre de Shields

You've done your research, huh?

Terry Gross

And your costume that you wore on stage is in the Smithsonian Museum of African American History. Why don't you describe it? Because obviously it's worthy of the Smithsonian. So describe it for us now.

Andre de Shields

Remember, the Wiz opened on Broadway on January 5, 1975. It was the peak of the decade of permissiveness, particularly for men who thought of themselves as beautiful. So we were wearing tight bell bottom jeans. We were wearing short sleeved shirts. We were wearing these huge Jimi Hendrix afros. We were wearing jewelry, bracelets, big rings, and wearing platform shoes. So that's exactly what I invested in. The character of the Wiz, he wears a white jumpsuit that looks as if it were painted on him, as if he were out of a Marvel comic book. He has a long Krepe du Chien cape. He's wearing 5 inch white platform boots, and he is wearing character makeup that makes him unidentifiable, so that when he is finally revealed as just another loser,

Terry Gross

another fraud, another con man.

Andre de Shields

Yes, yes. There's a great impact on not only Dorothy and her three friends, but the entire audience.

Terry Gross

So you were in the Wiz, which was pretty incredible. And then just like three years after being in the Wiz, you're cast in Ain't Misbehavin', a musical review built around songs identified with Fats Waller. So let's hear a little bit of you singing from that. And most of the songs are sung by, you know, one or two other characters. It's a five person cast, and some songs have all five of you. So I'm gonna play part of the title song, Ain't Misbehavin'. And this is a part where you solo. We'll pick it up right before that.

Musical Performances

I'm saving my life for you oh, hi, daddy. Like Jack Horner in the corner don't go nowhere what do I care? Your kisses are worth waiting for Believe

NPR Announcer

me,

Musical Performances

I don't care to go I'm home about a. Just me and my neighbor's radio I can't afford one. I'm saving my love, you saving my love just for you.

Terry Gross

Ah, shucks, daddy, I love it when you move. Did you already love Fats Waller's music when you were cast on the show?

Andre de Shields

No, I wasn't a lover of Fats Waller's music, But I love the period.

Terry Gross

The period that he performed in.

Andre de Shields

Yes. The Halloween, 30s, 40s, Harlem Renaissance. Mm. Yeah.

Terry Gross

The literature, too.

Andre de Shields

Yes. And curiously, it is still that part of American history that is identified with black excellence. When indeed when February comes around the shortest and coldest month of the year and we celebrate black heritage, we have to remind people that black history is American history and the Harlem Renaissance was just one of its peaks.

Terry Gross

Well, I'm going to take a pause and reintroduce you here because I need to take a break, so let me do that. If you're just joining us, my guest is Andre de Shields. He's currently on Broadway in the Jellicle Ball. He won a 2019 Tony for his performance in the musical Hadestown as Hermes is in the new film of last year's London revival that reunited stars from the original Broadway show. It opens on Friday. We'll be right back. This is FRESH air.

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This message comes from Whole Foods Market. This is summer at its peak. Whole Foods Market Summer Fruit Fest is your invitation to eat the season fresh, organic and bursting with flavor. Start your day with peaches and organic blueberries and yogurt. Build a grazing board with fresh fruit, prosciutto and artisanal cheese. Then fire up the grill with no antibiotics ever, proteins and fresh produce. Savor the season. Shop Summer Fruit Fest at Whole Foods Market.

Andre de Shields

This week on newsmakers, Hunter Biden, I was seven years sober and somebody asked me if I wanted a drink. And 10 years later, I woke up in a motel with a crack pipe.

Terry Gross

The spiral of addiction and his father's legacy.

Andre de Shields

If my dad had won, he would have kept his word. He would not have pardoned me.

Terry Gross

Hunter Biden, this week on NPR's Newsmakers

Andre de Shields

Watch or listen wherever you get podcasts.

Terry Gross

This is FRESH air. Let's get back to my interview with Andre de Shields. He won a Tony for his performance in the musical Hadestown. He plays the role again in a new movie of the show, which opens Friday. And he's currently on Broadway in Cats, the Jellicle Ball. I want to change the subject and go back to the 90s when you were diagnosed with HIV in 91 and your partner 17 years died of AIDS. And then three years after that a partner of two years died of aids. Did you take care of them when they were really sick?

Andre de Shields

I did. I became the nurse.

Terry Gross

What was that like for you?

Andre de Shields

I'll share this with you. My first partner had been told by his doctor that if you ever run a fever of 104 or higher, you must immediately check yourself into the ER, the emergency room. Not too long after that, it happened. And I said to him, chico, you have a fever of 104. You recall what the doctor said? Do you want me to take you to the er? And he said, no. And I said, well, what do you want to do? And he said, I want to die in your arms. Simple as that.

Terry Gross

Did that happen?

Andre de Shields

Yes.

Terry Gross

Was it that night?

Andre de Shields

No, it was sometime later and it was in the hospital.

Terry Gross

What was her reaction when he said that? Was it to, like, try to convince him? No, go to the er. I'll be with you.

Andre de Shields

No, no, no, no, no, no. He was, he was Compos mentis. I asked him a question, he responded, and I acted accordingly until it was impossible to do so when I had to make decisions for him.

Terry Gross

How did it change you to be surrounded by the death of people who you loved? The death of people who were very close friends and who were colleagues on stage?

Andre de Shields

I became a missionary, and I became an advocate. And now aids, or at least hiv, is a condition that one can live with. I have for 45 years, which is remarkable. But what had to happen in this process, which is why I say I became a missionary, is that not everyone is infected with hiv, but everyone is affected by hiv, and that's because we have criminalized it. And what we have to do is remove that stigma.

Terry Gross

So we're recording this on a Thursday, July 16, and Cat's Jellicle Ball. And you're one of the stars that closes on August 8th. So there are not many performances left. What do you do during intermissions when you're doing a Broadway show?

Andre de Shields

First things first. Go to the bathroom.

Terry Gross

Yes.

Andre de Shields

As a matter of fact, when I was touring with the Me Nobody Knows, one of the performances was done at the Civic stage of the Chicago Opera House, and Katharine Hepburn was there doing Coco, and she allowed us to meet her at one point, because we had been asking our stage manager, why is it so cold in the theater? We shared space, and he thought, oh, well, this is the time for you to meet Katharine Hepburn. And two things we learned, don't perform in a temperature higher than 45 degrees. And even if you don't have to go, go. So during intermission, go to the bathroom whether you had the urge or not.

Terry Gross

You have a performance tonight, so I'm gonna let you go in a couple of minutes. How are you feeling about these final performances? Are you savoring, like, every minute?

Andre de Shields

Well, it didn't take the announcement of its closing to savor every minute. That happens eight times a week, because the people who are coming to see Cats, the Jellicoe Ball, are coming to celebrate not their own liberation, because we've arrived there some time ago, but that finally there's this intersection of history and evolution that allows it to be above ground.

Terry Gross

Andre de Shields, it's been wonderful talking with you. Thank you so much.

Andre de Shields

It's the highlight of my day. I'm going to share it with everyone at the theater. They love for me to bring these kinds of rare opportunities into their lives.

Terry Gross

Well, I wish you all the best. Thank you so much.

Andre de Shields

It was my pleasure. Thank you.

Terry Gross

Andre de Shields plays Hermes in a new film version of the stage musical Hadestown. It's the same role he won a Tony for seven years ago in the original Broadway production. The film opens in theaters this Friday. Tomorrow on FRESH Air, our guest will be New Yorker staff writer Gia Tolentino. She coined the term Instagram face. Now she's back with a warning. Plastic surgery has become so pervasive and undetectable, it's quietly changing what we think a real human face looks like. Her article our plastic surgery nightmare delves into what happens when we can no longer trust our own eyes. I hope you'll join us to keep up with what's on the show and get highlights of our interviews. Follow us on Instagram nprfreshair. Fresh Air's executive producer is Sam Brigger. Our technical director and engineer is Audrey Bentham. Our engineer today is Adam Stanischewski. Our interviews and reviews are produced and edited by Phyllis Myers, Annmarie Boldonado, Lauren Krenzel, Teresa Madden, Monique Nazareth, Thea Chaloner, Susan Yakundi, Anna Bauman and Nico Gonzalez Whistler. Our digital media producer is Molly Sivi Nesper. Roberta Shorrock directs the show. Our co host is Tanya Mosley. I'm Terry Grand.

Andre de Shields

This week on Wait, Wait, Don't Tell Me. We ask rock legend Vicky Peterson from the Bengals why she once filled in for the Go Go's lead guitarist, Charlotte Caffey.

Terry Gross

My friend Charlotte Caffey was pregnant with my ex boyfriend's baby. I like to put it. What? Yeah.

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Terry Gross

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Andre de Shields

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On this season of Planet Money Summer School, we follow the money and not just the dollars. We're following the yuan, the naira, the krona and more. Every Wednesday this summer, we're taking you on a world tour to meet the people, try new solutions to old economic problems. Planet Money Summer School. Grab some friends, pack your bags and don't forget the sunscreen. Listen on the NPR app or wherever you get your podcasts.