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Alex Ferrari

Next Level Soul, the place where we deep dive into the mysteries of existence, uncover hidden layers of consciousness, and explore the journey of the soul. I'm your host Alex Ferrari, and every week we sit down with the world's leading spiritual teachers, mystics, scientists and truth seekers to illuminate the path towards awakening. Here we ask questions that truly matter. Why are we here?

Where are we going?

And how do we elevate our lives, our purpose, and our consciousness to the Next level. This is a space for transformation, a space for expansion, a space to remember who you really are. So take a deep breath, open your mind, and prepare to step into your Next Level Soul. Now, if you're ready to take your spiritual journey to the next level, explore Next Level Soul tv. Our streaming platform filled with exclusive movies, docs, original shows, transformative series, guided meditations, channeling sessions, audiobooks, and deep spiritual teachings you won't find anywhere else. New content drops every week, helping you expand your consciousness and live from your highest potential. Start your journey today at Next Level Soul tv. The views, opinions, and statements expressed by our guests are their own and do not necessarily reflect the beliefs or positions of Next Level Soul, its host, or any of the companies they represent. Now, let's dive into today's episode.

I like to welcome to the show Marshall Sims and Bernard Heisch. How are you guys doing?

Marcia Sims

Great. Glad to be here with you, Alex.

Alex Ferrari

I'm excited to talk to you guys today because I haven't had. I've had many quantum physics, physics on, physicists on, but I've not had any astrophysicist on before. And it's a different perspective on the universe. An astrophysicist has, generally speaking. So my very first question to you is, how do you balance the imperial evidence with faith or belief in your professional and personal lives?

Bernard Heisch

Some of this comes out by looking at the, you know, the rules of science, rules of physics or astrophysics and the scene, how. How they fit together. Do they fit together or is there some major problem? I think it's possible to have these two disciplines simultaneously in hand and both of them propounding rules for the universe that are consistent with religion.

Marcia Sims

Yeah. You know, I think it might be important to go back to how did Bernie get interested in God and astrophysics?

Alex Ferrari

Fair enough.

Marcia Sims

And answers your question about how he balances it. So ever since he was a little boy, he always felt very spiritual and he felt a strong connection to God. He was raised Catholic, and he studied to be a Catholic priest. And he used to line all of his stuffed animals up on a bed in his bedroom and feed them communion. And he got quite a charge out of that. It made him feel like this reward, like he was connecting to God. So he did study to be a Catholic priest, but he always had an interested in the stars. Always just if you look up at the night sky, he'd be amazed at the wonder of the universe. And so astrophysics became more prominent, more important to him. And he also wanted to be able to have Relationships with the female sex. So, yeah, when you're a priest, you, you know, you have to kind of be secluded. And so he decided to study astrophysics at the university, Indiana University in Bloomingdale, Bloomington. Bloomington. Oh, Bloomingdale's is a department store star in Bloomington. And let's see, I do want to add that he had this faith from being a child. And a lot of times it's something you have to have an intuition on because it has to go on how you feel. But logically, as an astrophysicist, he was taught to think like a scientist and that National Academy of Sciences states that science is measuring things in the physical world. You know, everything to do with the physical world. Analysis, measuring, doing experiments, testing it, making theories. So he's really good at doing all that. But the National Academy of Sciences says that science has nothing to do with religion or spirituality because that's something you can't measure. And you can't measure God, really. You can intuit that there's a God. It's like, how do you know if somebody loves you? You can't. There's no love meter that you could place on that person.

Alex Ferrari

Other than at the carnivals. Other than at the carnivals. There's those love meters for like 25 cents.

Marcia Sims

But yes, you could judge on the response you get.

Alex Ferrari

Right.

Marcia Sims

Right now, if person loves you, they all go out of their way to do really nice things for you. They'll be compassionate, they'll be generous, they'll be sweet and kind. And so that's how God is to us. You know, Bernie has gotten many answers to prayer with, with God. And he always felt that intuition when he was serving communion to his stuffed animals. Well, how else do you want to balance it, Bernie?

Bernard Heisch

Well, balance is kind of a sub theme in this, in this book, because this is something that's written for people from basically two walks of life. One is the side where there's no religion held or tolerated or in any way.

Marcia Sims

People are fearful about hell. They're fearful about God's power. Yeah. They follow dogma and sets of rules that there their faith or their religion sets out for them.

Bernard Heisch

Right?

Marcia Sims

Yeah, Right. But science doesn't have anything to do with that. No. It's possible to be a scientist and to be spiritual, but you have to be open enough to see the spiritual side. I think that's how he balances it. Really. He's open.

Alex Ferrari

But it's very interesting too, because again, I. I've spoken to so many physicists who've come on the show in different fields, fields of physics. And they, you know, the ones that come on the show generally have an open mind to spirituality as a general statement. But most in, in the. In the general space don't really talk about spirituality, though more and more, I'd say now than ever before, are coming up publicly. Talking about consciousness, talking about quantum physics is really starting to open a bunch of doors into this space. And there's not as much fear, don't get me wrong, there's still very. A lot of fear about people coming out of the spiritual closet in physics, but it seems to be a lot more open. Would you guys agree with that?

Bernard Heisch

I would agree with that. Yeah. It's. It's time for there to be sort of choices can be made if you're perfectly neutral about religion. A choice to be made between following down the road of the strict men and certain mechanical explanations of things. And the other way, when you find in California, especially the religious.

Marcia Sims

Well, spiritual, not religious. We actually. We don't have the same definition of a religion as we do spirituality. Because religion is a set of rules that are set by whatever church anyone's affiliated with or specific interpretations of the Bible. And we're talking more about being attuned to the cosmic consciousness that we co create the universe with. We are sparks of God. And so we, as sparks of God, co create our reality, the cosmic we. And by the way, I wanted to say that when we use the term God, we are actually referring to an entity or a consciousness that has no sex. We may say he or she, but God is not a he. He's not a she. He's not a human form. He's not anything that we could actually imagine as human beings. People like to anthropomorphize God. I mean, we do not see God as a desert patriarch sitting in a throne with a staff and angels floating around him and continuously praising him on clouds of light and joy. No, God is a cosmic consciousness. He's a force. It's a great, great force.

Alex Ferrari

Well, let me ask you this. Let's take it back all the way to the beginning, the Big Bang, right. What is the implications of the Big Bang through the lens of spirituality? Because I always had. The only problem I've always had with the Big Bang is. I get it, it makes all the sense in the world. But what was around before the Big Bang? And that was always my question.

Bernard Heisch

That's the master question. You're right.

Marcia Sims

Age old question, right?

Bernard Heisch

Yeah, yeah. And that's in fact one of the things that motivated the book that I wanted to have a balanced perspective presented that could, you know, show the ability of the science and spirituality to live side by side and perhaps even to to get one side to learn from the other. That's my primary motivation in writing the book.

Alex Ferrari

We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor.

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Skyrizi Commercial Warning Voice

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Alex Ferrari

And now back to the show.

Marcia Sims

So we take it back to the very, very root of existence. And so Bernie and I did a lot of research on this and what we have found, at least this is our current model. And we use a model, by the way, we never say we have all the answers because he's a scientist, he has to have models, you know, and as you proceed towards understanding your model or proving it, you develop theories about it. So we're always in the process of gathering information, but we came upon the idea of the Einsof, which is the vast nothingness that's described in the Kabbalah, the Jewish Kabbalah, the mystical Kabbalah. So we've, we, we believe at this point that the great cosmic consciousness of God fell out of the Einsoft and just existed as a while, as an awareness, a force of power. And this existence got very lonely, all being all by itself, because all there was for its companion was the Ein Sop. And that doesn't really do anything for you, right? So God decided I need to have experiences, I need to have companions. So God created this force, we think the zero point field, which is a very vast electromagnetic field that's been around since the beginning of the universe. And we can tell you more about that later. He has some ideas for how to tap it. But anyway, this zero point energy, he used it to create the Big Bang. And so the Big Bang started as an infinitesimal, tiny, tiny little point that had so much pressure. Stop me if I'm not explaining, okay. And it just exploded and the zero point energy was there with it. And this huge explosion created the universe. All the vast galaxies, star systems, planets and things evolve from that.

Bernard Heisch

No, it's not really an explosion because that implies that this happened inside a, a, an ordinary space, four dimensional geometry. And that, that is now becoming a big question in, in cosmology among those who are experts in the zero point field to try to get some understanding of what there was before time. I mean, you can't have, you can't have a something happening before or after. If you don't have an after or before. It's just impossible to, to try to understand something in our, our notion of the, what space time is to, to come up with a model. And no one's, no one knows how to do this yet because we're trying to get a model of nothing. And if we go back off and say, well okay, let's go back even, even further with this idea of nothing, then what made nothing happen?

Marcia Sims

Well, that's probably, we got to the Einsoft because that was all we could find.

Bernard Heisch

Regress, infinite regress. And that's both A. I guess it really is a scientific problem. It's metaphysical, but I think primarily it's a problem of understanding something that's more complicated than our three dimensional, three plus one dimensional space. And somebody at the youth, the zero point field had to come out of that. But how could it. Because you can't make something happen if there's nothing to flow along our time to make things happen. And we just have no ideas what's at this point, I think of what kind of thing time is like. If it changes its character from what it is in our ordinary space to something deeper and more profound. That's a big mystery.

Marcia Sims

That's a big, huge subject. Time. I mean as a human being, time is passage of events, how the day changes, you know, the sun rotating, I mean the Earth rotating around the sun and. Yeah, that's right.

Alex Ferrari

But then time, Time and space is interesting because with quantum entanglement it is kind of put materialism unnoticed, if you will, in many ways because it just defies time and space. And I've spoken to many spiritual masters, I've spoken to a lot of near death experiencers. And the way that there is no time or space on the other side, according to them, because everything is instant, you think it, you're there. And quantum entanglement is kind of a, almost like a little bit of a, a spark if you will, if I use that word, of what it is like on the other side. Can you explain quantum entanglement a little bit to people to. So they really understand what it is and how it's kind of thrown a lot of things upside down.

Bernard Heisch

You can in a laboratory set up a situation where you have maybe a batch of electrons or photons. There are different things, but they follow some similar quantum laws. And what you can do is to take that one pair of these particles and in some way you have them interact with each other in the laboratory and you shoot one off where it may go. And the entanglement interpretation shows that the, the two, the two either electrons or photons or whatever you're using, they, they have the same, some certain same, certain same properties that will hold good for the rest of the age of the universe unless some, something comes along. And well, I guess I would say

Marcia Sims

why don't I. Bernie, why don't I talk about the double slit experiment? Because that, that shows quantum entanglement. It's a really famous experiment.

Bernard Heisch

This is an expert by Niels Bohr, by the way.

Marcia Sims

Oh, he's the one that did the first experiment. People are still doing the experiment he

Bernard Heisch

proposed, it was not a lab guy. He was a theoretician.

Marcia Sims

Okay. Well, the double slit experiment is one of the most bizarre experiments in physics, and it cuts to the heart of the weirdness of quantum mechanics. So this experiment's done in a lab with a laser and a screen that has two narrow slits in it. The laser beam has to be wide enough to shine on both slits. When you cover up one of the slits, as the light from the laser passes through the open slit, a pattern will appear on the wall behind it. This pattern is due to the spreading out of light, a process called diffraction. In this case specifically, single slit diffraction. But if you uncover the second slit, the light going through the open slit will still undergo diffraction. But in addition, the light beams traveling through the two slits will interfere with each other. Did I say that right

Bernard Heisch

here? Is that they. Yeah, they're tied together. And the theory says that they're tied together for whatever age you want of the universe because there is that they are connected to each other, even though you can't connect them in any way. That it's like a physical notion. It's this. They're entangled and they support each other in very mysterious kind of way that quantum mechanics has to be used to, but doesn't have any clue as to what was happening.

Marcia Sims

Still, it shows how the photons are connected to each other. In quantum entanglement, if you're shooting two

Bernard Heisch

photons away from each other, then the photons will get entangled. Or you can do it with electrons as well, or other. Other more massive particles, I assume. I've not seen much about that.

Marcia Sims

So the conventional explanation is that each photon somehow knows that even though it goes through slit A or B, it is also in the same. In the open position and vice versa. The wave is a wave of probability. Yeah.

Alex Ferrari

So it's kind of like when two twins are across the world from each other and one gets burned and the other one feels it.

Bernard Heisch

That's right.

Marcia Sims

You got it. Summed it up.

Alex Ferrari

It's. It's. It's. It's unexplainable. But there has been a lot. I mean, there has just been so much proof and about these kind of things that have happened throughout history, like the twin thing. I mean, anyone who's ever been a twin understands that you feel it. Or even a mother and a child, you feel like, oh, something's happened to my kid, and they just get this instinct that just pops in the second it happens. That's not quantifiable in, in materialism or in time and space. But there's something going on there and I think we've all experienced it at one point or another. And we can use the example of a phone call that the phone rings and you know who it is before you pick. They pick, you pick it up. There's some sort of weird connection that's in the, the quantum field or, or the, what would you call it, the magnetic field that you were speaking of

Marcia Sims

Electromagnetic field at zero point energy.

Alex Ferrari

Is that kind of like a quantum field?

Marcia Sims

Is it burning zero point energy? It's a vast electromagnetic field.

Bernard Heisch

That's right.

Marcia Sims

Energy.

Bernard Heisch

That's right.

Marcia Sims

I mean Einste and Max Planck knew about it. So people have known about it since the early 1900s. It's not a new theory and I mean it really is acknowledged. The truth is. Can we tap it? So Bernie has come up with an idea.

Alex Ferrari

So how do. So how do you tap it? How do you tap it? We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor.

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Skyrizi Commercial Warning Voice

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Alex Ferrari

And now back to the show.

Marcia Sims

You want me to tell you about it? Sure. I have a little summary page that would actually help me. So it's broadly recognized as a vast field of electromagnetic energy. It's also known as the quantum vacuum field. This field represents the underlying energy that is everywhere in the universe, even where there is nothing. But vacuum is composed of every frequency or wavelength that exists. Some are short and others are long. It's perfectly random. It's an infinite source of energy. And Bernie and our company, Jovian J O V I O n dot com, if anyone wants to look us up, has come up with a way that we believe could provide humanity with an endless supply of totally clean energy without violating the second law of thermodynamics. Our process has nothing to do with heat is electromagnetic. So there's a Casimir force that happens between two parallel metal plates that are pushed together by an overpressure of the ZPE from the outside of the plates. And the reason is because if the plates are really, really close together, the longer waves of the ZPE cannot get into the plate, can't pass through, so it becomes, you know, like a little vacuum inside. And this is called the Casimir force. And it happens down at the nano level. So it's very, very tiny place. And it can be. We believe the ZPF can be manipulated through use of nano sized Casimir cavities. By squeezing out photon energy, electron orbitals of an atom spiral down inside the cavity and photons are emitted. Our process then sends the photons through a photovoltaic cell and electricity will be generated. So in this way it would be captured in a device we would call the Casimir generator or the cg. And it's portable. You can use it for driving cars, for hospitals, kitchens, whatever you need every. Yeah, and

Bernard Heisch

somewhat more more friendly to the environment than the fusion energy would be because here you're really, really taking nothing out of the energy of the universe except doing that, taking energy of the universe through your experiment.

Marcia Sims

So the air that passes through the Casimir cavity as it goes back out to the main area, it's replenished. So we're not using up any resources.

Bernard Heisch

So the situation is that we apply for a patent on this device, and we actually got a patent on it some years ago. And I was quite thrilling to get that. But then came the awkward requirement to go find some money.

Marcia Sims

Yeah. Prototype. We've had several experiments that had some very promising results, but we haven't had the funds to get the proper kind of Casimir cavity. We need to research and get more information to create a prototype. So that's where we're at.

Alex Ferrari

Well, that sounds fascinating. Is. Is this. Is this technology that you guys are talking about? Is. Did Tesla touch upon any of this, or is that a completely different way that he was trying to do kind of like this free energy?

Bernard Heisch

He was. He was trying it the way we described.

Marcia Sims

He was trying.

Bernard Heisch

Also he had other things in mind that were sometimes not so.

Marcia Sims

Broadcasting electricity.

Alex Ferrari

Yeah.

Marcia Sims

Hours.

Bernard Heisch

Yeah.

Marcia Sims

Yeah. This is not like that.

Bernard Heisch

Okay.

Marcia Sims

Is on, you know, portable. On location, wherever you are.

Bernard Heisch

I wouldn't. I wouldn't hesitate to give some credibility to Tesla.

Marcia Sims

He was brilliant. He was a genius. Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

Alex Ferrari

Without. Yeah, without question. And they're still trying to figure out a lot of the stuff that he was talking about back then.

Marcia Sims

Better of our alternating current, which the world works on. So he deserves a lot of credit.

Bernard Heisch

He did.

Alex Ferrari

Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. So what you're saying in regards to this. This four. This. This field that we're tapping into it, as you were describing it, it sounds very much like the force from Star Wars. It is around us. It's all around us. You can manipulate it and then just kind of. It sounded very force. Like, in that sense, maybe you don't need to be a Jedi. But I'm just using. Using that as an example.

Bernard Heisch

Right. Because I'm sure.

Marcia Sims

I think there's a lot of truth to the Force, actually.

Alex Ferrari

Oh, absolutely, Absolutely.

Marcia Sims

Well, I mean.

Alex Ferrari

But go ahead, Bernie.

Bernard Heisch

This was something. I certainly could have crossed his desk, and he would be very comfortable with this. And the thing is that the energy inherent in this field is literally infinite. And so you can pick out pieces of it that are at wavelengths that are not going to be belligerent because most weapons or most experiments and theories wind up somehow or other supporting weapons.

Marcia Sims

Yeah. Cannot be used for weapons.

Bernard Heisch

Yeah.

Marcia Sims

This.

Bernard Heisch

This, I think intrinsically cannot be used for any weapon because you pick out certain frequencies in the field, you can extract them, if we're correct. But you're not going to extract a whole bunch of other stuff which could become explosive, you know, as in the instant hydrogen bomb. So this seems to be a benevolent usage of the zero point field that couldn't be turned into weapons by anybody. Anybody, no matter how much money is thrown at it.

Alex Ferrari

Yeah, you use the word frequency, and I think that's a very interesting word to use because on a spiritual standpoint, frequency is spoken about so much that you have to change your vibration. The lower the frequency. The soul is. Is at a lower frequency, so it attracts certain things to it. The higher the frequency, you can feel that energy. Do you believe that the universe is just essentially frequency? That frequency is fundamental? Fundamental.

Marcia Sims

Well, we think the universe is consciousness, really.

Bernard Heisch

Yes, but is that a fruit?

Alex Ferrari

But is that consciousness? A frequency?

Bernard Heisch

Is the question, what is frequency? Frequency without. Without something to frequent. This is an undefinable right. You can make anything have a frequency. Guitar is an excellent example. The frequencies are the various notes you find in the scale. So the frequency has to be defined in terms of what it is that's frequenting.

Marcia Sims

At this point, I would just like to let everyone know that Bernie has Parkinson's. So if he's slow speaking, it's because of his illness. He's doing an amazing job.

Alex Ferrari

Yes, he is.

Marcia Sims

And doing this book, by the way, this is his fourth book.

Alex Ferrari

That's excellent.

Marcia Sims

Yeah, well, I helped him write this book because it's hard for him to type. And I actually put a lot of my own ideas into it too, so.

Alex Ferrari

Very good. No, I appreciate. I appreciate you letting. Letting everybody know that I was going to let them know as well. It's very courageous what you're doing, Bernard, about with these interviews and getting this information out into the world. And that's what I'm trying to do with this show as well as to have these conversations reach a mass audience as much as we possibly can. Now, I wanted to ask you. This is one of my favorite topics. I'd love to hear your point of view on it. Simulation theory, the idea that we are in a conscious simulation. Very much Matrix, like from the movie the Matrix. I don't believe that we're in a side of a computer somewhere and there's some teenage alien playing us as a simulation. I don't believe that. But the concept of Maya from the Vedic text, or the dream in from the Aborigines or so many other things, the concept of the illusion that we are all part of has been around for thousands of years. And now physics is starting to catch up to this idea, quantum physics is starting to catch up. I'd love to hear your point of view on it.

Bernard Heisch

Well, in fact, that's the central point of our book. Lay down a proposal, but a suggestion, a model. It's a model of reality that applies to all living things and all planets and us and so on. And this assumes that there is a God would do this idealized God is try to, as Marshall said, create companions of a sort and but mainly to exercise his own abilities by creating what he imagines. And that would be a lot more fun, create what you imagine than doing just the hard work of imagining and not creating it.

Alex Ferrari

We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor.

Skyrizi Commercial Narrator

I love days like these at the pool, but my moderate to severe plaque psoriasis can sometimes take me out of the moment. I'm ready to make a splash with clearer skin thanks to Skyrizi risankizumab RZA Skyrizi is a prescription only injection for adults who are candidates for systemic or phototherapy. At four months, most people saw 90% clearer skin when measured from head to toe and many were even 100% plaque free. People also saw significant improvement in psoriasis symptoms of pain, redness, itching and burning.

Skyrizi Commercial Warning Voice

Don't use if allergic to Skyrizi. Serious allergic reactions, increased infections or lower ability to fight them may occur before treatment. Get checked for infections and tuberculosis. Tell your doctor about any flu like symptoms or vaccines.

Skyrizi Commercial Narrator

Now there's nothing on my skin thanks to Skyrizi and that means everything. Ask your doctor about Skyrizi, the number one dermatologist prescribed biologic and psoriasis. Visit skyrizi.com or call 1-866-Skyrizi to learn.

Ryan Seacrest

Hey it's Ryan Seacrest for Albertsons and Safeway. Save up to 50% off your favorite self care brands this summer. Stock up on wellness products like Cortisone 10 Ultra Soothing Cream, Dualcolax Stool Softener Gels, Claritin 24 Hour Allergy Tablets, Nature's Truth Magnesium Cortisone 10 Cooling Spray, Dualcolax Stimulant Tablets and Nature's Truth Elderberry Gummies. Enjoy Savings on top of savings when you shop in store or online for easy pickup or delivery restrictions apply. See the website for full terms.

Lady Luck

Hey everybody, Lady Luck here and we're celebrating America's 250th birthday. Now all summer long I'm going to be celebrating by playing on spinquest.com which is an American owned social casino. It obviously features over a thousand slot games and live Blackjack, live craps, live bubble crafts. Head on over to spinquest.com get yourself a $30 coin pack for just 10 bucks.

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Alex Ferrari

And now back to the show.

Bernard Heisch

So think about, think of God wanting for some crazy reason to go ski down a mountain. Okay. Wants to go skiing. Well, can you do that as God?

Marcia Sims

No, he can't.

Bernard Heisch

Because even God can't make, can't make the ski boots or ski or skis that would suit or accommodate his principles. So if he wants to go skiing one day, all he has to do is create ski resort and ski apparel and he can go skiing as much

Marcia Sims

as he wants to through human beings. He experiences through the human beings that ski.

Bernard Heisch

Right. And then the, the importance of this thing that has been done is that he will understand what can be done with the laws of physics that he has created. And that's in fact the whole purpose of it. Because if God did not have some outside reference to work guests and compare his understanding to other people, then there would be no fun in the skiing down the mountain.

Marcia Sims

In other words, God wanted to create a universe full of interesting stuff so he could play and learn and grow. And you have to experience, and he couldn't experience as a consciousness that he could experience through us and all the animals on the planet and, you know, other living beings.

Bernard Heisch

What fun is a diploma.

Marcia Sims

You know, you have no K mates, Right? Yeah. So we're proposing that God imagines all of the cosmic reality, the universe, by organizing his thoughts into computer like algorithms that run in his mind. This requires unbelievable bandwidth and data storage, but it solves one of the greatest mysteries of all time. So God is a mathematician, and if you look at the world around us, math is apparent in every aspect, especially in physics and science, especially, you know, even in music and art.

Alex Ferrari

Yeah.

Marcia Sims

Art is full of mathematics. Oh, yeah, the golden mean in art and music. Well, so music is based on math, really. I mean, every, the distance between every octave. Bach made sure he measured it out correctly. Johann Sebastian Bach, the father of modern music, created each half step to be the square root of two. 12. Sorry, 12th root of two. That's square root. 12th root of two. Yeah. And then when you. So and by doing that, every instrument could play together in an orchestra or a band because they would all be in tune with each other.

Bernard Heisch

Are we hearing each other now?

Alex Ferrari

Yeah, yeah, absolutely. The Qu. The. The. I've been using that concept of the algorithm. God's algorithm for a while now. First I've heard that some that used it as well because I always thought it was because I'd be using it as an example because people are like, well, if we have free will, then, you know, how can we have predestinies and all this kind of stuff like, you know, we're down here to go down certain predestined paths, but if you have free will, how is that possible? And I was like, well, it seems to me that we're God's algorithm because an algorithm has a direction, but it kind of does what it wants and can figure things out in ways that we, the creator of the algorithm didn't see coming. So it would learn. It's AI Essentially it's learning and growing, but it's going on its own direction. So the algorithm has free will within a box of parameters that it's set in. So it sounds very similar to what we are down here. And if, and this is just the one planet, let's not even talk about the billions and billions of other planets in the universe. God knows what's sitting around other algorithms that are being FL that are being tested around the universe as well. Which is very, very interesting.

Bernard Heisch

Yeah, that God has a motive to figure out recipe sitting here and, and having different ideas that basically explain what God's motivation is. This, that's, that's highfalutin thinking, you know, and if we're right, we've got something that should appeal to a lot more people than the, you know, the materialistic versions of God on one side and the, the I don't believe in God, I'm an atheist the other side. I think we've offered a good starting point for a reasonable middle that is not only going to, I think, compatible with materialism and psychism, but it's going to be a learning tool even for God himself to learn how, how, how. Or what he is and what he can be done, which is infinite.

Alex Ferrari

Well, no, I was going to say it's like when, when you're, when you're a kid and you're playing with your Barbies or you're playing with your GI Joes, you as the creator, the God of, of that environment that you've created, you have characters and you have a predestined way that you're fighting with them or telling a little story or things like that. But you as the creator understand where the story is going because you're creating the story as we go along. But as an algorithm, it's kind of like throwing a GI Joe and a Barbie together. I'm like, let's see what happens. And that's a much more exciting story because you really truly don't know which way it's going to go. So the idea of us being the algorithm of God makes so much more sense than there's this big puppeteer. Just because that's boring. If we. It's just a boring story. It's a boring way of looking at what we do here. So this free will thing is really fundamental to this entire cosmic algorithm, algorithm simulation that we're all kind of sitting in.

Marcia Sims

Definitely, yeah. I have an interesting quote I was going to. Brian Whitworth, a professor of information processing and technology in New Zealand, puts it all this way. One of the mysteries of our world is how every photon of light, every electron and quark, and indeed every point of space itself seems to just know what to do at each moment. The mystery is that these tiniest parts of the universe have no mechanisms or structures by which to make such decisions. Only God, the algorithm could make those decisions.

Alex Ferrari

You know, I was thinking the other day, I don't know if you guys have animals or not or have had animals in your life, but I was looking at my cats, I have a couple cats and I was looking at them and the way they react to us as a family, they're kind of like small algorithms with sets of rules. Cats will be cats, cats will not be a dog, won't be a giraffe. It has its pre built algorithm of how it reacts to us. And I was just looking at them like, well, if that's the case, then a tree has its own algorithm, a tiger has its own algorithm. You know, a bear has its own algorithm in the sense of the way it interacts with us. That's why I always get upset when people are like, oh, that tiger went crazy. No, the tiger went tiger. You got in its way. It didn't get in your way kind of situation. But it again goes along with this idea of this algorithm that everything, every blade of grass, every bird that's flying, it has its own pre built programming or way that it interacts with this environment. Does that make sense?

Bernard Heisch

It does, very much so, yeah.

Marcia Sims

I think you put it really well. Perfect. So cat algorithm, the dog algorithm, the turtle algorithm.

Bernard Heisch

But they're only propensities.

Marcia Sims

I have, I had a turtle for a long time.

Bernard Heisch

Oh yeah.

Alex Ferrari

As they do then their algorithm lives a long time if you feed them right. But there's all these sets of rules and even something as you know, something as simple as a blade of grass is conscious. It's not the level of consciousness that you and I might have, but when the sun comes out, it angles itself to get the sun, you know, and there were some amazing experiments. I saw, I saw, I forgot who, who was doing it, but they were seeing how conscious a plant was. And they would. They would plant a seed and they would see where the roots would go, and they would put an empty dish and a dish with water underneath the soil to see where it would go. And it would automatically go toward every time to where the water was. It just instinctively knew its programming, knew it needed to get water. Then they actually played the sound of water to see if it would do it, and it went after the sound of water as well. I mean, it's just really fascinating, these ideas of what, what is conscious and what is not consc. In the world today. What do you think about that experiment?

Bernard Heisch

Well, I think it's a good one. And there are other experiments that show that the plants in general have a consciousness of some sort. They can react to external stimuli.

Marcia Sims

And, well, I have to tell you, when I was getting my teaching credential at the University of California, Santa Barbara, we as student teachers conducted an experiment in a room. We grew plants to different kinds of music to see how they would respond.

Bernard Heisch

Sure.

Marcia Sims

So we had a section that listened to classical music, and those plants, fruit tall and straight and flourished. Then we had some plants that were listening to rock music and they got a little bit jaggedy, a little twisted and Muzak. Muzak was soothing to the plants, but they didn't grow as tall and straight as the classical music. Isn't that interesting?

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Marcia Sims

Classical music is very mathematical. And I was talking about that earlier when I was talking about the mathematical nature of music. And I mean, when you think about the rhythm notations, the quarter notes, eighth notes, half notes, and time signatures, I mean, it's all based on math.

Alex Ferrari

We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor.

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Lady Luck

Hey everybody, Lady Luck here and we're celebrating America's 250th birthday. Now all summer long I'm going to be celebrating by playing on spinquest.com which is an American owned social casino. It obviously features over a thousand slot games and live blackjack, live craps, live bubble crafts. Head on over to spinquest.com get yourself a $30 coin pack for just 10 bucks.

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Alex Ferrari

And now back to the show.

Marcia Sims

And I think this is one of the things I wonder about music. Whether God uses music as his mathematical expression or algorithm through sound. Is it possible that music is mathematical because the universe was designed by a pure mathematician? It has the greatest influence on us of anything abstract in the world. And it undergirds all of society. You know, it's impossible to get away from music. Yeah, it's everywhere. It's all pervasive from classical music. I mean, I have to say I'm a little bit fond more biased towards classical music because I'm a music teacher and opera singer. But I still like pop, I still like rock, I like DJ music, you know, and you can experience God through music in church. If you go to a church service.

Alex Ferrari

Well, you know. Well, you know what's really interesting, I come from filmmaking. I've been a filmmaker for many years and I've worked in Hollywood. And story is also something that's everywhere you can't get away from story. It is true absolutely every. Every aspect of our life, even from, like, this is what just happened to me when I walked down the street. We constantly are telling each other stories, but the classic stories that have stood the test of time are mathematical in the beats of when certain things have to happen in the story that the Joseph Campbell put it, the hero's journey. That's why a story like Star wars hits these beats so perfectly. And then you start analyzing all old films and you just say, oh, there's the beat, there's the beat, there's the beat, there's the beat. It is absolutely mathematical. And art, I mean, just look at the Mona Lisa or you look at a Van Gogh or. And you can start breaking down the mathematics of art, which doesn't seem like it is, but it's there. Always underlining behind the scenes.

Marcia Sims

Oh, yeah. But I'm also a graphic artist. And every time I start a project, like, if I'm doing a flyer for my opera company, I'm on. On a board of an opera company called Verismo Opera. It's in San Francisco Bay Area. And I have to measure everything out. Like, what size do I want the card? What are the margins going to be? Like, how big is this logo supposed to be? How. What font size, what font type? You know, how is it going to fit into this little space? How are you going to balance everything out? I mean, it's all mathematics to the eye, right?

Alex Ferrari

And that's the thing. Isn't it interesting, though, like, when you look at. When you look at something that's off balance? As a graphic designer, because I've been doing graphic design for many years as well.

Bernard Heisch

You.

Alex Ferrari

You can't. If you're a layman and doesn't understand graphic design and you look at something, you'll just go, that doesn't feel right. But then you move like, oh, let's just move it over to the left. Okay, that feels better. It's fascinating. It's fascinating to see. Like, you know, we as graphic designers can kind of see what's going on behind the scenes because we have the theory and understanding of it and also just our instinctual eye that we've developed over years and years of working in that space. But when something's off, the. The layman or the. The man on the man or woman on the street won't know what it is wrong, but they can tell. Same thing with music, same thing with story, Same thing with movies. Same thing with art. They could just sense Something is off. That's why when anything veers from the standard story structure that has been around for thousands and thousands of years, people, mass people generally don't like it. That's why every big blockbuster runs through that same structure and many versions of it, but still runs through that structure. And when it's off, when you watch a Fellini film, it's very different than when you watch Titanic. Oh yeah, the beats are slightly different or David lynch film for that matter.

Marcia Sims

They're all good, but they all have

Alex Ferrari

a different, different, different thing. It's very interesting. Now I wanted to ask you guys, what from an astrophysics standpoint, can astrophysics inform the concept of reincarnation or rebirth?

Bernard Heisch

Well, I don't think that anything out of astrophysics could have much relevance here. But in fact I believe in reincarnation. I think it's essential to carry out, let God carry out his plans. You see, if, if you want to have a rich life, you want to be able to live it according to your own free will. And that free will would not be possible if we woke up one morning and said, well, gee, I've reincarnated and now I'm in this. So it would be worthless to live a life in that kind of, that kind of reward system because you would know what you've done before and do it differently and, and it would hinder your abilities to operate as an independent, powerful human being. Well, it's that, that I see as the, the biggest asset of reincarnation, that you can live multiple lives and that they have a purpose. And that purpose is that you can live better and better lives if you go through them, you know, with, and

Marcia Sims

you can make up for mistakes that you made before you get other chances.

Bernard Heisch

Right.

Marcia Sims

It's not like a one time thing. And wow, oh, I blew it. I guess I'm going to hell.

Alex Ferrari

Right, Right. But the thing is, the key to that is that we forget that we're not informed about those other lives or why we're even here is the discovery aspect because according to spirit mature spiritual masters I've spoken to and near death experiencers is that there is a plan that we come down here with, but we don't know the plan. We have to kind of discover it. And sometimes we have the free will to go off off course and completely missed the point.

Marcia Sims

But you know what we know, I mean, at least I, I can speak for myself. All right? I know when a certain something happens in my life, you know, a certain episode, I know what I'm supposed to Do I can see two choices. I could see, yeah. Well, if I follow through on this, it's going to be kind of tough, but I'm pretty sure I'm supposed to do it because the alternative is to go and do something else. For instance, writing this book. So Bernie has been working on it. He worked on it for about five years, but, you know, because he got Parkinson's, he was having problems completing it. And, you know, he was kind of hinting that he needed help, but he didn't actually ask for it, except one day he said, okay, Marcia, I really want to finish this book. By the way, we're a husband and wife team, I should say. We've been together for 36 years. So I know him really well, but he asked me for help, and he said, if you help me, you can put your name on the book alongside mine. And that made all the difference in the world. And then I knew. I mean, I spent several months helping him clean this book up, organize it, edit it, whatever. But I knew that was one of my purposes here was to help him write this book. And I think it's his most powerful book, really. Did I mention the title?

Alex Ferrari

Of course, yes.

Marcia Sims

The Miracle of Our Universe.

Alex Ferrari

Well, let me ask you. Let me ask you, though. This book is coming out. It is available now in this time period. So would this book have even been accepted 30 years ago?

Marcia Sims

Probably not, right?

Alex Ferrari

I mean, he. I mean, Bernard would have been laughed out. Probably laughed out of the field at that point in time. Is that. Is that fair?

Bernard Heisch

Yeah, that's fair. That's a possibility. Yeah.

Alex Ferrari

Yeah. I'm stating that because it just seems that everything is just shifting so much that these ideas are being more and more widely accepted by people. I mean, I don't remember a time where, you know, someone like me is sitting down with an astrophysicist or a quantum physicist and talking deep, you know, physics kind of conversations mixed in with spirituality. This really didn't exist 10 years ago, 20 years ago, in. In a mass way, but now there shows talking about it all the time. So I think it's. Do you believe it is the time for this information to start hitting the masses?

Bernard Heisch

I think it's time for that. And also it's time for.

Marcia Sims

It's a new view of consciousness, God, science and reality, which is what's going on right now.

Bernard Heisch

I think it's also something that might be. Might be proven within the year or so, because we now have. We have a huge number of aerial phenomena that have been observed over the last several years I've probably quite pretty diligently because I think it's a it's really deeply involved and we are deeply involved with that as a way to have our civilization go through a phase transition from what we have now to

Marcia Sims

something much different with all the observations of the UFOs or UAPs.

Bernard Heisch

Yeah, jazzed by that because I think that if it comes out as I respect it will it's going to upset the world significantly and hopefully.

Alex Ferrari

We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor.

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Alex Ferrari

And now back to the show. Absolutely. And I think we have to kind of be. I think we have as a, as a species, have to get to a certain consciousness to even accept this idea without us completely losing our minds. And I think that we have been growing in consciousness. Humanity's consciousness has been evolving, I think at a. I think at a very fast rate over the last 10 years. I mean, because what the strides have been made in these kind of conversations in the last 10 years probably are more than they were made in the last hundred prior. I mean, it's just very fast.

Marcia Sims

You know, I. As horrible as the pandemic was, it gave us all time to have our own personal internal space and dialogue, which we often don't get because we're so busy with things and, you know, our lives. But during the pandemic, they're probably as a turning point for our race. You know, we decided to get more spiritual. We started meditating because we had time to meditate.

Alex Ferrari

Yeah. I mean, if you would have told me the entire world shut down for six weeks, I mean, to the point where the dolphins came back to Venice, I mean to the canals of Venice, like literally after like a few weeks they were coming back into the city. I would have said, you're insane. That sounds like a science fiction movie. But in our lifetime, the entire world pretty much shut down to a certain extent for about six weeks and, and then of course, it took a long time for everybody to come back out. But you're right, it is, it was the, it was a very difficult time for all of us, but in many ways hidden blessings to giving us that time to kind of reflect on our lives to the point now that the west are like, no, I don't want to work 9 to 5 and work 40 to 60 hour weeks for 40 years and then get a watch that. That doesn't exist anymore. That's gone. You know, I want to work at home. I want to do this. I want to have life, work, balance that didn't exist pre, pre pandemic. Now guys, I want to ask you a few questions. I ask all of my guests.

Marcia Sims

Okay?

Alex Ferrari

What is your definition of living a fulfilled life?

Marcia Sims

Realizing my dreams is fulfilling my life. I have a lot of dreams, things that I want to achieve. I've actually done a lot of the things. Maybe finishing this book is one of the biggest ones because sharing thoughts that I've had, intuitions I've had, you know, with the World for anyone who cares to read the book. You know, we put our heart and soul into this book. So Bernie especially. I mean, I helped him shape his ideas. So it really is kind of a synthesis of all your ideas, wouldn't you say?

Bernard Heisch

Yeah.

Marcia Sims

Yeah. So I guess fulfilling my life is fulfilling my dreams and having a richness of, you know, joy and happiness and love and healing and light, whatever. What do you. What's the fulfilled life for you, Bernie?

Bernard Heisch

Well, yeah, writing something like a series of books is certainly. Yeah. I feel that's accomplished something that I came here to do and I'm proud of, and it accomplishes a purpose, I think. So that's what, to me, is life.

Marcia Sims

Yeah. He finished it. He said he always had the dream from when he was a young boy that he wanted to write about God and science.

Bernard Heisch

Yeah.

Marcia Sims

He did it.

Alex Ferrari

That's beautiful. That's beautiful.

Marcia Sims

Yeah. So he has four books. He has the God Theory, the Purpose Guided Universe, Proof of God with Ptolemy Tompkins, and then the Miracle of Our Universe, A New View of Consciousness, God, Science and Reality by Bernie and myself. We have a copy here.

Alex Ferrari

Beautiful.

Marcia Sims

Yeah. So that's. That's fulfillment.

Alex Ferrari

All right.

Marcia Sims

To you, Alex.

Alex Ferrari

Oh, I think I'm. I think I'm doing it. I'm thinking doing it. I mean, I've. From where I came from, being a filmmaker and working with Oscar winners and all that kind of stuff back in the day to do a spiritual podcast, which is completely outside of my comfort zone when I started it.

Marcia Sims

Yeah.

Alex Ferrari

And it's fallen into something that is shaping and impacting millions of people around the world. This is. I feel that I'm. I'm very fulfilled doing this kind of work.

Skyrizi Commercial Narrator

So it's.

Marcia Sims

It is really fulfilling. Yeah. To share spirituality.

Bernard Heisch

Our son is also an up and coming filmmaker. Big break to get into the film business.

Marcia Sims

Taylor Heisch.

Bernard Heisch

Yeah.

Marcia Sims

Yeah.

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We.

Alex Ferrari

We will. We will have a conversation about it after we. We stop recording. I'll tell you all about the. Now, if both of. If both of you had a chance to go back in time and speak to little Marcia and little Bernie, what advice would you give them

Marcia Sims

to little Marcia? Be confident in myself. Be confident that I can be beautiful, that I can do great things. I think that is one of the things that I've learned over time to gain confidence and then be confident that I have things to share with people around me. And I'm proud as a little Bart, Big Varia of my ability to persevere. I've always been a very persistent person. Bernie will Tell you I don't give up. Even long beyond. But I should. I don't. I don't give up. I always find workarounds. So I guess that's one thing I would tell little Marcia, too. Don't give up. Find a workaround. If you run into a wall, that's important.

Alex Ferrari

Very important. Very important. And you, Bernie?

Bernard Heisch

Well, I started to say I have two kids, and in terms of what they would learn from.

Marcia Sims

Three.

Bernard Heisch

Three. Two of my own, and one is an adopted daughter from Marshes. So what to say to them, I guess to be true to themselves and try to find something that is really significant to them, that they can invest their. Their. Their abilities and also their. The yearnings for. And that would be if I. If I do that in the right way, then if I look back at that and say I have done it in the right way, that would be fulfilling. Around about Babylon.

Marcia Sims

Yeah. But yourself, you fulfilled your dreams, right? Yeah, he fulfilled his dreams. I mean, he still has more to go, I'm sure, but. But right now, at this point in time, he has kept going. He has not given up.

Bernard Heisch

In fact, I would say that probably this book carries more weight to me in terms of my thinking of it as a healing tool and something to provide information for mankind. I would say this outweighs my scientific papers. I have over 100 scientific papers.

Marcia Sims

300.

Bernard Heisch

Over 300. No.

Marcia Sims

Yeah.

Bernard Heisch

And I've done other things in astrophysics. You know, I spent 10 years as a scientific editor for the Astrophysical Journal. So cadre of scientists that were responsible for accepting or rejecting the research in that field that goes on. And I was one of ten for a year. So there are other things besides the books and that, but it's, well, a pretty good life.

Marcia Sims

Yeah.

Alex Ferrari

Now, how do you define God?

Marcia Sims

God, a great cosmic consciousness that creates reality and as we said earlier, spun off the universe and the star systems and the planets and the humans and the animals spun them off so that God, He. She could have experiences. So because we're a creation of God, we're a spark of God. So we see it as God, as a consciousness. You could say it was a force. Consciousness is a force. It's an awareness. Did I leave anything out that you want to say about God?

Bernard Heisch

Million things. Probably.

Marcia Sims

Probably. Yeah. But it's the higher power. Well, so oftentimes people approach God when they're in great need. So otherwise they are kind of oblivious. But God can answer our prayers.

Alex Ferrari

We'll be right back after a word from our sponsor.

Skyrizi Commercial Narrator

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Skyrizi Commercial Warning Voice

Don't use if allergic to Skyrizi. Serious allergic reactions increased infections or lower ability to fight that may occur before treatment. Get checked for infections and tuberculosis. Tell your doctor about any flu like symptoms or vaccines.

Skyrizi Commercial Narrator

Now there's nothing on my skin thanks to Skyrizi and that means everything. Ask your doctor about Skyrizi, the one dermatologist prescribed biologic in psoriasis. Visit skyrizi.com or call 1-866-Skyrizi to learn more.

Ryan Seacrest

Hey, it's Ryan Seacrest for Albertsons and Safeway. Save up to 50 off your favorite self care brands this summer. Stock up on wellness products like Cortisone 10 Ultra Soothing Cream, Dual Collax Stool Softener Gels, Claritin 24 Hour Allergy Tablets, Nature's Truth Magnesium Cortisone 10 Cooling Spray, Dual Collax Stimulant Tablets and Nature's Truth Elderberry Gummies. Enjoy savings on top of savings when you shop in store or online for easy pickup or delivery, restrictions apply. See the website for full terms.

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Alex Ferrari

And now back to the show.

Marcia Sims

And so I guess this is something important I want to say. How do you realize or how do you know if God actually answered your prayer? And does God answer all of our prayers? So God gives you answers that not necessarily in the time frame that you would like. Sometimes right away, sometimes down the road you can see answers in by observing the world around you. I mean sometimes you might get an answer from God by looking at a road sign and the answer is right there embedded in the road sign message or by looking at A license plate or coming out of the mouth of a friend or, you know, radio program you are listening to. But your prayers do get answered, just not always in the way you might expect. So do you have anything else to say about prayers and prayers? Oh, it's important when you pray to God to be really clear about what it is you want, you know, not just some vague thing like oh sure, pray for, pray for Deborah or whatever you want to say. Well, these are the things that I would like to come about. You know, that she's healed, that her back is perfect, she has love in her life and joy and friends. You know, that kind of stuff. Not just a general prayer, but exactly what would you like to see in that person's life appear? So God really knows what kind of answers you're looking for. Five senses, you know, Fair enough. Touch. Smell. Yeah, yeah.

Alex Ferrari

Now where can people find out more about you and the amazing work you guys are doing in the world?

Marcia Sims

Well, we have a website, it's www.themiracleofouruniverse.com and we're also on Facebook. The miracle of our universe. You just search for it in Facebook and it pops up. I have an Instagram account, Marcia Sims 40 and the book is available for sale on Amazon and other major book seller outlets like Barnes and Noble and Walmart and Target. So I guess those are the major places. Look on our picture. Red wheel wiser. There's the page about us there. Yeah, plenty of ways to get to us.

Alex Ferrari

And do you have any party messages for the audience?

Marcia Sims

Well, I would just like to share with everyone how you can get your guaranteed ticket to heaven, because that was the original title of our book, by the way. And so I wanted to. I put this in the book and it's in the book in the back section. So I wanted to share. Everyone. You have a guaranteed ticket to heaven because you are a spark of God and you're part of him or her. The alternative would be help. Answer is because we are sparks of God. Why would God condemn a part of himself to eternal fire and damnation? It's illogical. You know, if someone does something that you know deserves negative karma, well, it can be paid off, you know, if you do enough good deeds, but it can be paid off. So how you experience heaven while you're here on earth, it's important to be in a state of gratitude because this opens your mind for optimism, love and God's still small voice. The good news is that anyone, even you, can achieve this if you take the time to meditate and distill your monkey mind. It may take a lot of practice because the mind likes to loop around in thoughts. So one of the ways that I still my mind is I sit in a quiet place and count backwards from a hundred. And I sometimes have to do it so fast to stop the thoughts that there's not a space for a thought to come in. But it does slow down. And then as it slows down, you can melt right into the beauty and grace of God. I get a lovely kind of spring green and purple and some magentas, and they kind of swirl around inside my mind's eye. And then I know that I am communicating with the cosmic consciousness.

Alex Ferrari

That was beautiful, Marcia. Thank you so much. I want to thank both you and Bernie for coming on the show and not only talking with me today for my audience, but also for the amazing work that you're doing to raise the consciousness of the planet. So I appreciate both of you. Thank you so much.

Marcia Sims

You're welcome, you're welcome. Our pleasure. You're delightful host. Great.

Alex Ferrari

Thank you for spending this sacred time with us today. If you feel called to explore this conversation further, you'll find the show notes for this episode@nextlevelsoul.com 396 and if your soul is craving an even deeper journey, step into Next Level Soul tv, our streaming sanctuary for spiritual films, documentaries, original shows, guided meditations, channeling sessions, audiobooks and transformative teachings. It's a space created to support your awakening, your healing, and your return to

the truth of who you really are.

Begin your journey at Next LevelSoul TV. Until next time, keep expanding, keep seeking and keep walking your path towards the next level of your soul.

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