A

Foreign.

B

Welcome back to the Audible, presented by Trader Joe's. I'm Ralph Russo from the Athletic, joined today again by my colleague Stuart Mandel. And again, there's only two of us. Bruce Feldman, our other colleague, is out and about, I believe next week. Finally.

A

We're not sure if he's ever coming back, to be honest.

B

I mean, you know, the funny thing is, Stu, you go to Europe. Me, I go to Europe. Bruce goes to football camps with his son. He's probably like chatting up and he's probably taking like scouting reports of a bunch of 12 year olds that he's gonna like, you know, empty the notebook on us in a couple of years when they're at elite 11.

A

There's no question we're getting a call by the end of the week. I was, yeah, ran into the Cowboys strength coach and we were, yeah, we chatted for an hour or so and I found out X, Y and Z.

B

Got this interesting intel on North Texas's offensive line. Yeah, that's, that's how Bruce goes on vacation. On today's show, we're going to hit the mailbag. As always, we bring on a special guest, Lucy Rodin. She is, she covers college football independently. You may know her from the. Her days on the Dan LeBatard show and those college football road trips. She was an interesting perspective. Iowa slanted in some ways. As always. We start off with a little bit of news. Today is realignment day, Stu. Like all the things that we have been talking about and covering in realignment and, and things that are still trickle downs from Texas, Oklahoma, Stu, all those go into effect on July 1st. We have Mountain west and PAC12, all these things. And I guess the one thing I was going to ask you before I quiz you on how well you're keeping up on this stuff is. Yeah, like we are still doing the trickle down from Oklahoma, Texas, Stu. It really is mind boggling you when you realize like just what a monumental bomb went off on that day in. I believe it was July. Was it July? Yeah, it was July in 2021. I was in Indianapolis interviewing Mark Emmert when that happened. Crazy. Crazy how far we'll be honest.

A

I hadn't, yeah, I hadn't thought of it that way. I, I feel like, I mean, the ones we're going to talk about are direct Descendants of the PAC 12 blowing up. Right. Which was, which I think of as started with USC and ucla. But you're right. And that in itself was a response to the SEC taking Texas and Texas A and M the I'm sorry, Texas and Oklahoma the year before. Yeah, July 1st is always a significant date in college football. It's like the beginning college athletics. Right. It's the beginning of the fiscal year. So when there's conference schools changing conferences, it's always tied to July 1st. By the way, this. I didn't really see anybody mention this, but it kind of dawned on me that today, July 1st is the five year anniversary of nil becoming a thing. It went into effect on July 1st, 2021. I remember the Cavender twins on the billboard or whatever. Like, ah, the quaint days when we thought NIL was just going to be athletes doing endorsement deals.

B

Yeah, that's right. It was another monumental event that went to effect in July 1st. Okay, so here's what we're gonna do and I'm gonna be full disclosure. I cheated on you a little bit. Podcast cheating. Stu, Today I went on. Before we recorded this podcast, I did a stint with our colleagues David Ubben and Chris Vanini on the bunch formation. First time I've ever been on. They wanted to talk about our 90s series and ties. So I went on with them a little bit before. So yes, I cheated on you podcast partner. On that show. They did a game show type thing where Chris gave us. Gave David and I schools and we had to guess what conference they are now in. We are not going to do that. We are not going to do that. I'm not going to. I'm not going to wholesale steal their idea, but I'm going to steal it a little bit. Stu, I want you to name the schools that are now in the Mountain West.

A

Great. So this is like the Charles Barkley tries to guess which players on which team. Right. Like this is the version of that where that.

B

Dude, there's something like that.

A

Yeah, there's. Starting last year when like Delaware joined a con. Like we have now reached the point of, I don't know that I know this stuff off the top of my head. Right. Like I was able to keep it all up there for all those years. Like, how many teams are we at now? 1:38.

B

Is that where we're at now? 1:38. Right. Because North Dakota State, we had a

A

couple move up just in this off season. Yeah. All right. Gosh. Mountain West. Can you give me a number so that I can at least try to count up to that?

B

Sure. There are. There are nine full members. There are three more, what you would call partial members of. Of those three. Partial.

A

All those.

B

Of those three partial members, two of Them are football only. One of them is everything but football.

A

I don't have to guess that one, right?

B

If you could guess that one, you would absolutely win. If you can guess that one score

A

one of the foot. So one of the football only is NIU and which I remember because that is so like to this day. Why is NIU in the Mountain West? Nobody has ever properly explained that to me. Okay, unlv, Air Force, New Mexico, who else is still a holdover? Hawaii is. Oh, that's one of the football only ones that's changed.

B

They are now a full member. They were football only. And after the all the moves of teams leaving for the PAC12, they are. They are now a full member.

A

So this is where North Dakota State is now.

B

Yes,

A

but wait. And Sacramento State, Right. They were lasted three minute edition, Stu.

B

Sacramento State is in the Mac. Remember that's the move of niu.

A

The Mountain west didn't want them so they went to the Mac and they bought their way into the Mac.

B

The move of NIU created of NIU Northern Illinois going to the Mountain west, which by the way, if you see the geography of where northern Illinois is, maybe not quite as crazy as it sounds like it is a pretty far west in. In Illinois.

A

But how are they going to get to these place? I guess for football you can just charter a flight to Colorado Springs. But it's a good thing they're only doing in football. It's just, let's put it that way.

B

Yeah. I mean we're not taking trains anymore, Stu. This is not like they have to. Like they have to take.

A

But if you're flying commercial, if you were flying commercial, you can't. First of all, where. Where does NIU normally go to fly from? Not. I would hope not o'. Hare. That's a long one.

B

I don't think so.

A

No.

B

Maybe St. Louis. I don't even know.

A

But then they're going to a lot of places in the mountain that aren't direct, you know, that also are not going to be. Anyway. All right. I've lost track of how many dive. Six at that point.

B

I've lost track a little bit too. I think. You've. You've got Air Force, you've got Hawaii, you've got. You've got unlv.

A

Unlv. Niu.

B

Yeah.

A

North Dakota State.

B

Dakota State.

A

So I need. So I need three more.

B

You leave at least three more. I'm losing track here. I'm not. We're not going to do this forever. I'm going to put you On a timer. Think of some of the holdovers, though, you're missing.

A

Oh, I haven't got three holdovers.

B

Okay, three, four holdovers here. Obvious ones.

A

Obvious ones. And I said Air Force, right?

B

Yes.

A

And I said New Mexico.

B

I, I, I'm not sure if you said New Mexico, but now you've said New Mexico.

A

I could have sworn I said New Mexico.

B

You probably said New Mexico.

A

I'm gonna shout out, Jason, I, I see. I should be getting the holdovers. There's really no excuse for that.

B

That's the problem with this, though.

A

I think the ones that keep coming to mind are the ones that have left, like Colorado State. Oh, Nevada's still there. Yes, Nevada's still there. Wyoming's still there.

B

Absolutely.

A

Is the. So that's eight. Was the last one a holdover or a new one?

B

There is at least one more holdover that you're forgetting. There's a one more new one and there's one more that's a little tricky. You're forgetting one. You're forgetting one obvious holdover. And the reason why it's tough for you to not be getting this one is because of where you live. You're not that far from where the school is.

A

But not Fresno. They're in the PAC 12 now. No, closer.

B

Much closer than Fresno to where you live.

A

San Jose State.

B

Exactly.

A

Sorry. San Jose State. I don't know why I was having to rack my brain for that. The one I do not know is if there's another newcomer and it's not Sac State. You, you got me. Who is it?

B

All right, this is, this is the one that also tripped up Ubin when I was on the other show, though. I got it. UTEP is now a member of the Mountain West. And here's the one you are never going to. And frankly, I was never going to get it until I looked it up. Grand Canyon is a member in everything but football. Okay, but they are considered a football.

A

Admit I missed that one. Like, all right. I do remember seeing that. The news of utep I. Grand Canyon. Where was Grand Canyon before Grand Canyon

B

was in, I believe was in the old or the new version of the whack. Here's another one for you that you were never going to get. UC Davis is now a member of. Of the Mountain West.

A

In football.

B

No, I don't believe it's football. I don't believe they're all there. They, they are in football. No, they are in everything.

A

If they were in football, then I missed an FCS move. And I don't think I would have. Okay. No, I actually did better than I thought I would. What's the next one in this game?

B

No, no, no, that's it. I. I think. I think we've done enough.

A

Name the Mountain West.

B

Because frankly, I thought you were going

A

to ask me to Name the new PAC12.

B

Do you want to name the new PAC12?

A

At the risk of embarrassing myself? Yes, I do.

B

Okay.

A

Because I think.

B

Go for it.

A

They should get their due. Because that's really the most significant thing that's happening is it's back, baby. The. The. The band has sort of kind of gotten back together. Okay. Oregon State, Washington State, Boise State, Fresno State, Colorado State, San Diego State. How many more?

B

Oh, gosh, you got six there. I think you got about four more.

A

Utah State.

B

Utah State. Did you say Fresno State?

A

I know you did say Fresno State.

B

Okay, you say Fresno State.

A

Seven. I'm thinking there. There is definitely gotta be one more.

B

They went a little off the board in terms of state. Exactly. But you're forgetting one other non football. One very important one.

A

Oh, Gonzaga.

B

And Gonzaga. Okay.

A

And we might be a good basketball conference. That's the thing.

B

It should be. It should be.

A

I think it's kind of the glorified Mountain west, but it's going to be a good basketball league.

C

Yeah.

B

It has a chance to be a little better. I think what's interesting to make it a little more serious here, I think the most interesting thing about that conference is how. How Oregon State and Washington State, if they are able to, because they have a little more revenue in their coffers because they had some holdover, some war chest from the old Pac 12. I think they are hoping in Pullman and Corvallis that that puts them at the top of the food chain in that conference as opposed to being toward the bottom of the food chain when it came to revenue for years and years in the PAC 12. So.

A

Well, I think the problem for Oregon State has not been money. It's been coaching. You know, you still gotta. You still gotta hire good coaches. And they totally whiffed on promoting Trent Bray. That was not the right guy for that job. So now, you know, is Jamarcus shepherd, that guy?

B

We'll. We'll see. I mean, the money piece of it and the. Suddenly you're not a PAC12. Like, you're not playing those schools. It's been rough. I mean, our heart goes out. My heart goes out to those schools because they just had such a whole bl into them and hopefully it gets a lot better. Now, hopefully it gets a lot better now. Okay, the other little piece of news here is Wisconsin has a new athletic director, Sean Eichhorst, who was the athletic director at Nebraska for a short period of time. Most recently, he was part of Crystal Conte's staff at Texas. At Texas. So Icorst has. He has got some Wisconsin ties there. The only reason why this came across, Stu, as being a bit of an. Oh, really? That guy, Sean Eichors, when he was at Nebraska, made one of the worst hires ever. Maybe not ever, but certainly ever in Nebraska. He hired Mike Riley, and Mike Riley, away from Oregon State was a sweetheart of a man and a good coach, but he was mostly hired because he was a nice guy and he was replacing Bo Pelini, who was a pain in the ass. Like, it really was as simple as that. So I don't know, man. Like, if I'm Luke Fickle, I may be wondering, like, how is this one going to work out for me, Stu?

A

I think it's bizarre. I do. Now, look, the thing about ads is hiring coaches, and especially hiring football coaches is such a tiny, tiny percentage of their job. Like in terms of time spent on it, right? They fundraise, they manage a budget, they hire coaches across a lot of whole other sports. But what are they mostly judged on and remembered by the hires in the big sports? And there's no question, like when, when. When it came out yesterday, I was like, that's the first thing that came to my mind. Really? That guy, he's the one who hired Mike Riley. Look, Texas athletic department is humming, and one thing they've been particularly good at is generating revenue. So if he played a direct role in that, then yeah, that's a good sign. But that's not, that's not the first. That is not, not in the first 10 to 15 to 20 names, at least that I would have thought, oh, yeah, that that guy could be their next ad.

B

Oh, one more thing about Wisconsin, the other big news, maybe even bigger news, frankly, than their new athletic director. Wisconsin now has a jersey patch. Culver's is the. Like, you grew up in the Midwest, Stu, but I don't know if you grew up in the Culver's part of the Midwest.

A

I didn't grow up in the Culver's part of the Midwest, no.

B

Okay. Yeah, Cincinnati.

A

But I certainly, I certainly know it well. And I'm. And I said. I said to you guys on Texas, sh. Possibly the most perfect brand partnership that has ever existed. When I think Wisconsin, and offensive linemen in particular, I think Culver's.

B

It is. It made me think of what other possibilities. Like, could Penn State be Wawa or sheets. There's actually more sheets around Penn State than there are Wawa. And if either one of us was from Pennsylvania, we could get into an argument about which one's better. Wawa sheets. It's a very personal thing for people who live in Pennsylvania. We are not that discussion. So, yeah, I was thinking of some others, and that was one of the other ones that came to mind here.

A

But Alabama should have a jersey patch deal with Dreamland.

B

Oh, that'd be pretty good. Yeah. That's a little. I don't know. Can you think Dreamland? Can.

A

I don't think they have that kind of cash.

B

That kind of cash. Would that really. Would that work out for Alabama? I don't know.

A

Can I just say, though, that, like, now that this is happening, now that the schools are finally ripping this band aid, I'm like, why. Why did it take so long?

B

I know.

A

I mean, this is not controversial. Like, jersey patches, like in. In the NBA in particular. Like, in, frankly, most. I mean, look at the World Cup. Look at some of these jerseys. Like, having a corporate logo on your jersey has been a thing in most sports for many, many, many years. Right. But because college likes to think. I think they've given up now for so long. Like, well, that's. We're. That's beneath us. We're not about the money. No, no, no. You need the money. And as long as you're not doing something, you know, I mean, obviously, like, something really inappropriate shouldn't be on your jersey. But, I mean, the warriors are Rakuten. Like, the main reason. I know what Rakuten is, is because it's on the warriors jerseys. Like, it doesn't have to be a naturally. Oh, and I think Bay Area. I think Rakuten.

B

Yeah.

A

Mac, our producer. No gambling brands just stay away from. You say that. I. I agree. I agree. But, like, was it. Oklahoma State recently announced one. With. With a Native American tribe there, which is fine, but they do operate casinos. So we're gonna take a quick break, and we're gonna have our guest here in a second.

B

Joining us this week, very special guest, Lucy Rodin. So if you're not familiar. I am very familiar with Lucy's work. Cause Lucy was a regular cast member on the Dan LeBatard show for a while. And, Lucy, I wanted to thank you. I love the Lebartard show, and I still love the Lebartard show with and without You. But I always felt like your job as well as Jessica's job. Jessica Smith. Hannah's job was to elevate the college football conversation on that show. Like you like. They're great. They are wonderful. But often the college football conversation got a little bogged down, a little Miami centric. And I thought you brought a great perspective to college football, a national college football perspective, and insight and knowledge to that show. And also the place where Lucy's work was most impactful is road trips. Lucy has been a lot of places around the country, and she does great videos and amazing content. So thank you very much for being here, Lucy, as you sort of start a different phase of your career.

C

I'm happy to do anything to save people from Miami. Hurricane talk. I've taken that upon myself. Call myself, like, would I use the word hero? Probably. Yeah, I definitely would. Somebody had to do it, and I did.

A

So it seems like you're everywhere. You have a lot of. You wear a lot of different hats. Ralph mentioned the. Ralph just mentioned two of them, frankly. Also, you do a lot of videos. Right. Kind of like. Right. How you're framed right now, like, looking at the camera, espousing about college football. And so that's not the right word. Opining about college football. So, yeah, I've always been curious, kind of how you develop that niche.

C

Yeah. So I graduated from the University of Iowa, as did my dad. So I'm like a lifelong Iowa Hawkeye fan, which builds some character, does something for a person. And so it was very much. I describe it as Stockholm syndrome, where I was like, I don't want to watch this. This sucks. And then I had to. I really ended up loving it. So it started with, I love the Hawkeyes. Then it became I love college football. And so I knew I wanted to work in some level of sports, so I went to college for journalism. I thought I would be a journalist. I'm not that by any stretch of the word. And then I graduated 2020. Like, May and Covid hit. I had no other options, and I just started making videos. And then it turns out I was like, I'm actually kind of good at this, and I like it, and it's funny and it's different. And I'm not doing local news in a small town in Wisconsin, which is what I always thought my life would look like. And I'm so grateful that it worked out that way. And so eventually I just, like, kind of learned my voice and started to develop. And I feel like I got really lucky with the timing of it. Of. I just sort of hit the moment where fans were changing how they consume sports from, you know, necessarily watching SportsCenter to, hey, I'm going to watch TikTok instead and get the information I want. And so, yeah, it's Ricky Stancy. I guess that's the short answer. That's why I like college football. Is Ricky Stancy.

A

Ricky Stancy. See, there's a blast from the past.

C

Yeah, he knows that.

B

I've told him, oh, that's even better. It's great to be able to meet your heroes. It really. Yeah, it's a. I made him very uncomfortable.

C

Don't worry about it.

B

Well, so again, I think the thing that you became known for at the LeBatard show is not just making college football videos, but going to college football games. And so let me dial it back, because you have now been a lot of different places. How many before you got into that role had you had a lot of exposure to a lot of different places? Obviously, I've been to Iowa, so I assumed you have been to a few Big Ten places. But how much did that role with the Le Batard show sort of expand your field and throw you into places you had never been before?

C

It expanded it quite a bit. So in college, I worked for the student TV station and they would send us to some of Iowa's road games. So I've been to most of the Big Ten west schools before, and I'm actually from North Carolina, so I went to Wake Forest. I don't know if that counts, but I've been to Wake Forest games. And so I have, like, some, like, a tiny level of experience just sort of outside of Iowa. But with the Levitard show, that was the first time that I was going to SEC games that I was, like, really getting to be a part of some of these bigger Big Ten environments that, like, Iowa just didn't play when I was at school. And so it was such a wonderful opportunity. I feel like I've seen most of the places on my bucket list at this point. There's still a few left, but, yeah, most of the SEC we've checked off. Most of the Big Ten we've checked off. I still haven't been to Maryland, but I'm, like, okay with that. And so, yeah, it's been fun. I love it. I got a lot of airline miles.

A

Yeah. I mean, I remember thinking, like, gosh, they must have a huge budget there because they're paying for you to go travel every single weekend during the season. And was the assignment if you will. Basically just, like, go capture what it's like to be at a Texas A and M game on a college football Saturday.

C

Bold of you to think that the Levittard show ever gave out assignments. That's very. That's a stretch. It was very much just like, go create something. And so I had had experience doing man on the street before, and that was, like, something I was very comfortable with. It's what I was hired to do for the LeBatard show. I really wasn't actually hired to be on the show that much. And so it was just go and capture the energy and the environment. And so I was really lucky. They gave me kind of a lot of autonomy of what that looks like. You know, I tried to change it and evolve it through the years, but that was kind of a slow process. But the goal was go to these places, because I think college football is the best atmosphere in American sports. I think it's really different. It's a super unique experience. I live in New York City now, and, like, people don't get it, so it's like trying to find a way to show them and explain them why College Station is so unique, why Baton Rouge is a different animal. And so that was always sort of the goal with those series.

B

I'm smiling, as you mentioned that, because I grew up in New. I live in New York now. I grew up in New York, left for a while to advance my career, like a lot of us do, and then came back here. And I think back when I described my college football fandom and how odd it is at 13 years old, I was in Queens, just enamored with college football. It was College Station. Where is that? What is that? There are lines on the field in Baton Rouge. First of all, Baton Rouge, that might as well be Mars. Like, all of those things were really appealing to me, these off places in different parts of the country. So, yeah, trying to capture that. That was one of the things that pulled me into college football as a kid from New York. And so, yes, bringing that to people who aren't always on top of it, I think is probably. And I think you do a good job of that. What is the sort of the mechanism by trying to make sure that you get something that makes the flavor, the unique flavor of the place, because you can find drunk fans anywhere, and those are a lot of fun. But how much of a challenge is it to try to say, like, here's what makes this place a little different from that place?

C

It's definitely a challenge. That's A great question. I would spend a lot of prep work ahead of time of just like one, I'm familiar with the traditions and things like that, but there are only certain things you can know about a school without having gone there or been a fan of that team. So I'm spending a ton of time on Reddit, which is normally a scary sentence, but this one is fine. And I'm trying to learn about hey, what are the restaurants at A and M that that every student goes to that the parents come back to? What are the places that like the die hard fans really spend their time pre game? Like what makes each one really like tick and special. So I do a lot of crowdsourcing of just Reddit and then I would do like a call to action every week of just like hey, did anybody go to Arkansas? What should I do while I'm there? And then when we are at the campus we do our best to one, highlight the game and what's going on because we try to pick these big games. But two, talk to people about what made your experience special here. Because I what I think is cool about college football in these college towns, something I try to make sure that I always keep in mind when I go to these places is this is someone, somewhere that people choose to spend four years of their life that they spend a ton of money to be a part of this. This means a lot to certain people and I want to make sure that I'm approaching it with that, you know, in mind of this is a very special place to a lot of people. I want to show that off. Sometimes it doesn't work. Sometimes the specialness of a place just misses me. But I try to look up everything I can ahead of time and make sure that each like place has their own special flair. Where like would Washington fans be proud of this? Yes. Then I'm cool with it.

A

So we're having you on right now because you have left the Lebitard universe and are kind of just striking out on your own, your handle. We probably should have said this off the top. CFB Lucy, on pretty much every social media platform somebody could could think of, right? YouTube, TikTok, Instagram, et cetera. And yeah, tell us a little bit about this new move and like, I don't know, is it scary? Is it like what you know, to not have like the backing of a, of a Meadowlark media, if you will.

C

It's definitely. It was scary at first. I've been doing it for about a month now and I feel it's Gone. Well, not the brag. It's going really well and I'm having a great time. Well, with the LeBatard show, you know, we were doing the off roading every year and it just had kind of run its course. Like it was sort of time for me to branch out. And something I know that you guys know as reporters who cover college football is when you're going to games, it's really hard to keep up with the rest of the stuff that is happening

A

because that's why I don't do it much anymore.

C

It's so tough to know everything that's going on. And so despite the fact that I've been to more college football games in my life over the last three years, it's the least amount of college football that I've been able to watch live. I'm spending the rest of my week trying to catch up. And at that point there's new information and things coming out and so you just feel a little bit behind. And so I knew that I was ready to, to one kind of take this. I don't like the term influencer, but it's sort of what I'm doing now is to take this sort of influencer route of like I control my schedule, I control what brands I work with, I control what my content looks like. And so I'm excited to spend a lot of this fall on my couch for the first time in a long time. And so, yeah, we're just making content. I wish there was some grand strategy. There probably should be one. I just kind of wake up. I'm like, this is what I'm going to talk about today. Some days it's easier than others.

B

This is an incredible collision by the way of new media and old media. Like you're. I don't know if we are the oldest media, but we are definitely old media and you are definitely new media. Yeah.

A

In fact, we're counting on this appearance to skew our audience. Younger, bring in Gen Z, please. Thank you. Lucy, I don't know is your audience is heavily. Like our audience is 99% dudes. I don't know if that's the case for you or can you bring in some, some women audience for us?

C

We're actively trying really hard. If there is a strategy I have right now, it's, it's. I prefer just speaking to women in general. So I'm really trying to grow that audience. I would say it's probably like 75% male right now. There are so many female college football fans. This is A big sport for women. That's why I like sort of the atmosphere or the avenue of using a TikTok or an Instagram, because it is so I can go out to the ether and have, you know, everybody see it. And I'm bringing in more women college football fans, people who are from New York and the Northeast who maybe aren't. College football people are getting attracted to this sport based off of just, like, these silly little algorithms. But, yeah, it's, you know, I'm very TikTok native. My screen time is disgusting, but it works, pays the bills.

A

I mean, obviously, it's not lost on you. There aren't a lot of women doing what you do, right? Like, there are obviously women reporters, and we work with, with several of them. But, like, like, I remember you and Jessica. I don't know if it was only one season, but you had a show where it was just the two of you talking college football. And I remember thinking that probably is the only, you know, two women talking college football show on the Internet, right? So, like, what. What is that? Like, to kind of be a unicorn, I guess, or maybe one of the unicorns. And, like, how do you get in this. In this? Like, you know, we're going through this with the WNBA right now. Like, guys can be awful to women on social media. Like, how have you navigated that?

C

That's a great question. One, I do feel lucky that I think there are more women in sports than ever and more women in college football than ever. And that's another, like, really wonderful aspect about my job being so social media, like, facing is that you are constantly meeting other women who do what you do that you would necessarily not know if this wasn't like, a TikTok universe or whatever. So I got to go to the Norway Senegal game a few weeks ago, and my whole section were women's sports creators, which is really, really exciting. And so I feel like there's a great community and we support each other really, really well. And Jessica has been a wonderful friend and is such an wonderful person to work with and an advocate and ally, and she's been really helpful for me of, like, the Levitard show was my first super, super national job. And so she was able to kind of help guide me and let me sort of understand what there when it comes to just, like, men being awful, I mean, I can't solve that. That is so beyond my pay grade. And, like, not your mother. And so men are awful to me all the time. And so it's just kind of one of those things where, like, I usually do call it out if I see it because I'm not one. I am not a be the bigger person type of gal. That is just not who I am. And I think that you should be called out for bad behavior. And usually when I call someone out for bad behavior, it does create a little bit of a mob mentality, but I don't care. You shouldn't have said bad stuff. And it usually doesn't bother me that much because, like, why do I care what you think? And every single time they're a father, they're a Christian and they're bio or whatever, and I'm just like, I'm gonna tell Jesus exactly what you said. And I know he's not gonna like it. So it really doesn't bother me that much. It's just like part of the gig, you know, I view it like any other job where, like, you have things you don't like about your job. That's just part of it.

B

Okay, let me spin it to something a little less serious, but also about sort of the way you do your job. And I know you're not doing the road trips anymore, though I'm sure maybe a few, you know.

C

Yeah, there will be some. There will be some for sure.

B

Hopefully there won't be. And. Cause you talked about something that's interesting there. Cause like, yes, we like to think of ourselves as journalists, though probably reporters. Like when you're a sports journalist is more for people who cover wars than people who cover sports. However, one of the things that you say you do very well and like, clearly you do very well. That I hate as a reporter is to just sort of walk up to man on the street. Not because I don't like to talking to a man on the street, but it's just awkward for me to get that going to sort of be like small talk into, hey, do you mind if I ask you about the game today? Or something along those lines? How did you get good at that, Lucy?

C

That's another good question. I did have my last two years at Meadow arc. We did have someone who helped with that. So there. We did have occasionally because, like, there are times where you will go up to somebody and immediately you're like, oh, this was a mistake. Oh, this was a bad idea. Whether it's they're boring or they're awful or one or the other. So we brought in a producer who would help do that. But my first year was something I was doing all on my own, Something that people would get mad at me online for doing which I don't really care about, but that actually helped a lot is I would make sure before every game that I had a piece of the home team's merch on because immediately I am more approachable. I am on your side. We're just two fans chatting. It made it much, much easier where they didn't view me as the bad guy or somebody who was trying to make them look bad. And so you just go up. The worst they can say is no. The best that happens is you get a great interview. And I just would have a system of I would ask two questions, start off with I'd always make like a self deprecating joke or something just to let them feel a little bit comfortable with me. And then after the second question I know if it's a good interview or a bad one and then we'll just hit the road. There were some. It's interesting that I guess I never realized it until doing these trips is there are some places that that's much harder to do than others. Where LSU is the easiest place in the world. We don't even ask anybody. We just pull out the microphone and somebody's going to come up and talk to us. Iowa was the exact same way. Washington, I was was like on my hands and knees begging someone to talk to me and they were just like absolutely not. And so it really like differs via school. But the worst somebody says is no, like ah, I'll survive.

B

Is there one particular place that was just. I don't know if your favorite but the most surprisingly fun. Like I know it's hard to narrow it down, but if I pinned you down to like one place where you were like this was just so cool, what would it be?

C

The one that I was surprised by is I didn't go in with like low expectations, but I didn't think that I would have the most fun. I did. Stillwater, Oklahoma State. I had a wonderful time at. We were lucky enough to go to the last year. It was good and the last time they played Oklahoma, but I had just the most wonderful time there. The fans were super fun. Obviously that ended up being a fantastic game and Oklahoma State won. But I was blown away by the traditions. I loved the stadium and the brick and how loud it gets there. It was. No one had ever been like, oh, you're really going to love it here. And then I went and was like, wow, that was one of my favorite experiences. I feel the same way about Oregon. Even though Oregon had like a little more hype going into it. I had a wonderful time at Oregon for the most part. I have really great, great experiences at 98% of the places I go.

A

That's the beauty of college football.

C

It's wonderful.

A

Can I just make one quick, content suggestion?

C

Oh, of course.

A

So the two of you are in New York. I lived in New York for eight years. And it is absolutely true that, like, walking down the street on a college football Saturday, you would never know that it's happening. Right? It's just a normal Saturday in New York. People are pushing strollers, blah, blah, blah. But then you would step. Go down the steps, and I don't. Is Blondies still there? That was the big sports bar when I lived there. Blondies, yeah.

B

Pretty sure Blondie's still there.

A

You would walk down the steps into Blondies and open the door, and it was every Big Ten that was the Big Ten, but every Big Ten fan base you could find, there were ones where the Alabama fans met. There were ones. And like, I, you know, if you want to do a video but also still be able to see the rest of college football that day, go hang out with some fans at the sports bars in New York because, like, they're crazy. Crazy. And they're like. It's kind of like seeing, like, animals at the zoo. Like, they're so out of place in Manhattan.

C

It's one of those things where, like, I do think that most of the people, not most, but there's such a big chunk of people who are here that, like, don't appreciate college football. But, man, you can't walk down the street in Manhattan without running into somebody wearing a Michigan shirt. They're everywhere you go. It's. I would call it a plague almost, because it's genuinely everywhere. So. And, like, Michigan fans really care. They're a really great fan base, but they're all over. Like, I see at least five Michigan fans a day. So I'm like, you know what? I do think there is some college football here. It's just all. They're all like, transplants from Ann Arbor.

B

Yeah, yeah, we are. Definitely. I mean, there's a reason why the Big Ten decided to, you know, latch onto Rutgers. I always say it wasn't Rutgers. It was just a staging ground. There's already all the Big Ten guy teams are here. So now you can just go to Rutgers and watch your favorite Big Ten team win. Right? That was the whole point of bringing Rutgers in.

C

We been there, done that, actually had a great time. Rutgers, that's a surprising spot that I really enjoyed.

B

Last one for you, Lucy, because you are an Iowa fan. How's Iowa going to do this year? What do you think?

C

I don't feel well. Is it like a cop out if I just say 8 and 4? I mean, I give that answer.

A

That's exactly what I was thinking.

C

8 and 4, it's a cop out. But I think Iowa, the schedule's pretty easy. It just is very unfortunate that their toughest games all happen right at the beginning of Big Ten play. I don't know what the quarterback situation looks like right now. I feel this is the best I felt about Iowa sort of state of the program wise in a while of just like, I think we're going in the right direction. Kirk has adapted to this new era, like, not a ton, but way more than I thought he would, more than Dabo's doing it. And that's shocking to me. And so 8 and 4, there's a chance for an upset this year. I'm just happy that when we play, you know, top 10 teams, we don't get blown out anymore. But I think the future. I feel pretty decent about it for Iowa. I don't know if this is the year just because quarterback is such a question, but everything else I feel pretty great about.

A

We actually talked in our previous episode, Ralph wrote this column about why we should bring back ties. And I was arguing the other side of it, and I said, can you imagine if Kirk Ferenc had coached in the era of ties? Like, how many. How many ties would he have on his career record right now? And would they have come at the expense of wins or losses, do we think?

B

So many punts recently this would be. Yeah. So many punts from the 35, Lucy. So many plays from the 35.

C

No one's happy about that. I will say that if they, like, brought back ties, I think it would help Iowa out. Honestly, it's been. It's been. Overtime has not been kind to us recently, but hey, we got a ranked win. I feel great about everything. We'll see what quarterback looks like. The fact they didn't go out and try to get somebody in the portal. I don't know if it makes me feel a lot better or a lot worse, but there's no in between. I don't. There's no middle ground. I feel terrible one day or amazing. The.

A

Well, one thing I appreciate about Iowa fans is they're generally very realistic. Like, you guys don't go into the season like this is the year we're winning the national championship. And if we don't, we're going to fire. Nope, not like that at all.

C

One playoff appearance would fix all my problems. Like, like, that's all I want. I don't, I don't care if we go and we lose by a hundred. Like, I just want to be there, so.

A

All right, well, tell people where to find your work.

C

If you want to follow me on social media at CFB Lucy and subscribe to me on YouTube, I'm making college football content every day. Most of it's not Iowa related. Some of it is, but most of it is not. So you're welcome.

B

Lucy said, thanks so much for joining us. Yeah, no, thank you guys.

C

This is so fun.

B

And we're back. It's time to dig into the mailbag. And since it is realignment day, question about realignment and a little bit of nostalgia. We've been nostalgic about the 90s here at the Athletic for a lot of this month. So this combines a little of those two. It's from Dan Maloof in Washington, D.C. frequent emailer to you, Stu, Today the power conferences compete for pecking order, all hoping to get big TV payouts. Back in the 90s that didn't seem to be so important. Nobody seemed to care that much that the ACC was a smaller scale football operation, he tried to say, than the Big Ten. Am I hallucinating this difference or did conference pecking order really matter less in the 90s? If so, why?

A

Stu, that's a great question. I mean, I do think the chase for big TV payouts had begun by the 90s. It really began in the early 90s. And Notre Dame, you know, going off and getting the NBC deal was the first like, wow, we're really doing this kind of moment. But I just think the big difference is the numbers were so much smaller. And so I am sure I don't have these numbers in front of me. I am sure the Big Ten 10 had a more lucrative TV deal in 1992 than the ACC, but it might have been the difference between Big Ten schools were making 7 million a year and ACC schools were making 5.5 million a year. Right? It wasn't quite so profound. The numbers just got so much higher as the years went on to the point where if you could get, if you were Maryland and you got an invite to the Big Ten and you're struggling financially as it is, like, hey, we can't turn that down right now. We're talking 10, 20 million more per school. Now it's even more than that. But there Was definitely a moment and I don't know, maybe you can pinpoint it. When did people start caring so much about the TV ratings? When did part of being a college football fan and like I remember during one of the 8,000 Big 12, are they or aren't they going to expand? Like everybody came to know who David Boren was from Oklahoma. It's like when, when did we start caring even about who, knowing who the presidents of these schools were. Like realignment definitely became more wonky at some point.

B

Yeah. So we are guilty, guilty of doing this, but I would also of perpetuating this and creating this. But I will also say we are guilty of that, but we are also guilty of doing our jobs. Right. I mean we identified that a big part of realignment, that realignment was being driven by these numbers, by TV ratings, by the desire to chase TV dollars. And all of a sudden that that was just shaping the sport. So I will never apologize for reporting, for doing my job, which is reporting and explaining what was happening. But by doing so we created the monster that we're talking about where all of a sudden fans understood this and started rooting for TV deals and rooting for TV ratings and rooting for market sizes and understanding that all that, that all that went into the mix. One thing I will say, and I'd be interested in your opinion though, Stu. So I think this stuff by the way, supercharged after about 2010 because remember the first massive contract that was like eye opening billion dollar deal was the PAC12s. It was Larry Scott's PAC12 deal that really was like, holy cow. So again, going back to Dan's point, the conferences were more like in the same ballpark of one another. But if you even go back to the 90s for just the TV money, like there were definitely discussions about, I'm sure which conference is best, but it didn't seem nearly as much of like vigorous. Like I think there was just an assumption. Every conference had a few good teams and a couple of weak teams at the end. But really, you know, like was the difference between Ohio State, Michigan and the rest of the Big Ten that much difference between Oklahoma, Nebraska and the rest of the big, Big Eight and Alabama, whoever and the rest of the sec. There was always a little bit more, maybe the SEC had a little more balance, but I think even competitively, Stu, it wasn't as skewed. And this heated conversation about which conference is best because that's going to be the thing that determines everything.

A

Yeah, I think that really, I mean it kind of began with the BCS, but it really full throttle once the SEC's reign began right. In 2006. And there was so much chess thumping and I mean just the way like really that game you talk about like impactful games in the history of the sport. Florida beating the living heck out of Ohio State in the BCS championship game in 2006 after Ohio State had been seen as untouchable all year. And in particular that like there was serious. We almost had an Ohio State, Michigan rematch because there was a perception that both those teams were better than the best team in the sec. And then Florida kicked the crap out of them and was like, you know, it became a rallying cry for the sec. Like see like we're faster, we're better and it just perpetuated from there. Right? But no, my recollection of early BCS days, like think about it, you had, I think people perceived the Big east as the weak, weakest. But outside of that, like some years the Big 12 was the best and some years the Big 10 was the best. And so you know, like there was an idea that they weren't that far apart to begin with and like you could have ups and downs. There wasn't this idea that like it is set in stone. SEC number one, Big Ten number two. You know, as it as much as it is today, although I would even say it's not. There's so few conferences, it's a little like we just kind of accept that the Big Ten and SEC are in this tier and the ACC and Big 12 are in this tier as opposed to when we still had five. And it wasn't like you could, you know, Big 12 fans would say, oh, we're just as good as this conference. And they had a case.

B

The difference is now the money has create because the money gap has grown. It's institutionalized, it's cemented. How about that? It's cemented these, these conferences in place to a certain degree, right? The SEC and the Big Ten are better because they have more resources. And to a certain degree it's perpetuated, it's become cyclical and sort of a self fulfilling prophecy. They have more resources, they're on TV more, they have the bigger brands, so they're better. And then you end up with, you know, 12 draft picks out of the Big 12 and 20 draft picks out of the Big 12and, and more than double that many out of the sec. So it goes back to the money. To a certain degree. The money has created these gaps and sort of and and, and, and tiered the conferences more than ever before.

A

TV revenue is the lifeblood of the sport. TV revenue is the reason the PAC12 doesn't exist right now. Right. Like, basically, if you were to go back to that chapter in time, it's, it's like, why did this happen? Because the Big 12 was able to get a deal for 31.7 million per school and the Pac 12 was not. So the Pac 12 schools left. Okay, Ryan McGuire with our next one. This is an interesting one. Ryan from San Francisco has a fun hypothetical for us. What is a strange, unexpected, or even absurd event that occurred off the field that most significantly impacted a college program, program's success or trajectory? With the benefit of hindsight, his two examples As a Gator fan, I always wonder what it had been without The Will Greer PED incident. Did he and Jim McIlwain lead UF? Would he and Jim McAwain have led UF to the playoff? Does McIlwain last more than two and a half years and have some sustained success? Yeah, because they were off to a great start. And then he got like halfway through the season. I don't remember what year it was. He got busted for PDs and, and McWain didn't last much longer than that. And then this one. I love this one. Remember when Ken Neo Matalolo was close to becoming the Arizona coach, only for Khalil Tate to end his candidacy via a tweet bashing the triple option? Would Arizona have taken him and won versus the failed Kevin Sumlin tenure?

B

Yeah, Stu and I were going back and forth trying to come up with some bizarre stuff that has happened. And so much of it is you think of like the sliding door moments of coaches being hired and fired. And realignment's got a zillion sliding door moments, but so many of them are also goofy or lack the goofiness that our emailer is asking about. And then we came up with this one and I'll give Stu credit, even though I'm the one bringing it in. Mike Price's tenure at Alabama ending in a SI story about his wild night at a strip club soon after being fought soon after being hired as Alabama coach. There's so many of again, the sliding door of like how Alabama got to Nick Saban, right? The rich Rod turning it down and things along those lines. But Mike Price was a pretty good football coach at Washington State for a long time and if that tenure doesn't end, who knows what happens with Alabama going forward. Stu,

A

no question. I just Thought of this one and I actually think it's like the case closed. This is the biggest one.

B

Cool. Go. Hit me.

A

Bobby Petrino and the motorcycle.

C

Oh.

A

Arkansas football was humming.

B

Yeah.

A

Double digit win seasons. I don't remember what they were projected to do that season, but like they

B

were projected to do that. They were considered one of the top

A

teams in the sec.

B

Yes.

A

And then Bobby Petrino crashes his motorcycle with his mistress on it and they. Now this becomes compounded, I would say. When Jeff Long made the decision to bring in John L. Smith as the interim coach to that season, didn't he

B

just promote John L. Wasn't John L. On the staff?

A

No, no, no. He brought him back. He had been on the staff. He had left and he had taken a job maybe in Utah somewhere.

B

Oh, okay. Was.

A

Was he a head coach? Did he leave a head coach? No, you. He was somewhere else and he came back.

B

You vamp. I'll look it up.

A

He came back to be the interim coach for just that season that went terribly. Then Brett Bielema comes in, which we all thought was a good hire at the time. It just didn't end up working out. And to be honest, Arkansas still hasn't fully recovered. Like they've had a couple decent seasons along the way, but for the most part they've never been the same.

B

Yeah, it's. It was. Yes, it was crazy. And you're right. Now again, the, the, you know, the, the. The landscape changing has also hurt Arkansas, I think. Right. I think, I think suddenly the sec, they became somewhat the outlier in the SEC and it's been hard for them to catch up. But yes, Bobby Petrino crashing his motor. Who knows what happens with Bobby Petrino, frankly, if he doesn't crash that motorcycle again. Arkansas. So yes, it definitely set off Arkansas football and subsequent other programs. Hell, he got another chance at Louisville after that. I mean, it's just a lot of things happened after Bobby Petrino crashed that motorcycle.

A

I think we could agree that Bobby Petrino ended up doing better in the aftermath of that than Arkansas football. Yeah, I mean, he won coach a Heisman winner. Like he, he did okay for himself.

B

Yeah, it crashed out again for Bobby. But he is still, by the way, offensive coordinator of the of North Carolina. You're right. As much as things have been rocky for Bobby Petrino since then, because that's what you sign up for with Bobby Petrino, he has probably had more success than Arkansas football. All right, last question here and I'll read this one to Stu. I'm also. I was A fan of this question because it, because it was somebody who agrees with me. And I'm always a fan of someone who's. Who agrees with me. This is from Andrew in Seattle. I'm on Team Ralph. And that I love the idea of bringing back ties instead of overtime. The debate on the last show got me thinking about how 2025 would have been affected if there were ties. Which specific games ending in ties would have affected last season most? He brings up off the top of his head, and it's the most obvious one. Penn State, Oregon. Right. If there was no overtime, that game would have been a tie. And who knows if maybe it's not quite so crushing. Another top five big, you know, top 10 lost for Penn State. Maybe their season doesn't go spiraling out of control. The biggest upshot of having ties may have been eliminating the tiresome argument between Miami and Notre Dame. There was a couple of Texas games that could have ended in. So what are your thoughts? What are the games from last year that you think would have had the most profound effect on last season if there were ties instead of overtime?

A

You know, my mind first went to the year before in that crazy Georgia, Georgia Tech game that went to, I think, seven overtimes. Did I, did I undershoot that?

B

No, I think it was seven. Yeah.

A

If they tie instead of Georgia pulling it out, does Georgia miss the playoff that year? They actually won the sec, so they would have been automatically in. But they would, it would have put them on, on shakier ground last season. I mean, it's funny because, like, this question made me go back and look at some things that I'd frankly forgotten. Texas went to overtime with both Kentucky and Mississippi State. Okay. If you put ties in there instead of wins, not saying Sark would be fired right now, but it would have, it would have been a much worse season for him. And also if, if in the Kentucky example, does Mark Stoops possibly save his job? Like, it's not a win, but it's, hey, we took Texas and Arch Manning and all those guys to the limit. We can still compete with those schools.

B

I also find myself, remember, see, this is my fuzzy memory because I seem to remember, remember Stoops really doing a poor job at the end of that game in terms of like playing for overtime, like with a long, like some kind of long field go, like just being super conservative to try to get the game to overtime. Which again goes back to my theory and my supporting my argument on why ties are so great or the possibility of a tie is so great because you get these coaches into the. These modes of. Different modes of thinking. Right. And I think. Stoops, if I remember a part of that one, our email mentions this one, but I think it's the most. It's the most obvious1. It's SMU and Miami. A game that went to overtime and SMU won in overtime. But it was. It was the second loss in the span of a couple of weeks for. Or a few weeks for Miami. And it set off this cascade of Miami starting the ranking period, the college football rankings, like nine spots behind Notre Dame because they had just lost these two games. And if that was game was just a tie, maybe Miami is only three or four spots behind Notre Dame, and maybe that allows Miami to progress a little more and surpass Notre Dame before the last rankings of the season. And we don't have Notre Dame throwing a conniption about getting. Getting passed on the last day of the season. So that game alone, I think, would have set the course of the season and the main debate, as our emailer, you know, points out to, in a very different way.

A

Okay, I just want to say this. I don't deny that this stuff would have been interesting, but I still think we are better off for having actually decided the outcome of those games.

C

Loser.

A

Fine.

B

It's hard to. It's hard to. It's a tough position for me to defend. Stu, I. I'm doing my best here. Yeah, I'm just doing the best I can to make this tie argument. And like. And by the way, just. I just wanted to shout out, you know, we get a lot of emails, so I'm sorry, I'm not shouting out the particular emailer. I'm sorry, but we get a lot of them. When I was working on this story, like, literally, I had been assigned it and I was working on it. I think I had done the first draft. We got a batch of emails suggested for our mailbag from our producer, and one of them was, hey, guys, I have a fun idea. I think we should bring back ties. So, Stu, again, I am not the only one. There are dozens of us, dozens, I say, who support this idea.

A

I think there's probably more than that because there's also people who think we should go back to. Who blow up the playoff and go back to the polls. Like, there's people who. Who. And we talked about it in the last episode. Like, nostalgia for how things used to be. Right. So maybe ties bring up a specific memory of when you first started watching college football.

B

Exactly. Tear away Jerseys, too.

A

So as we get to the Trader Joe's gift card, I have some news. One of our recent winners, Michael Galvin from Agora Hills, is such a regular winner that he has decided to pay it forward.

B

Forward.

A

He is. He is that that gift card that he would have gotten is now back in the mix. And so we can give two out this week. Ralph.

B

So I would vote for. Well, how about this? How about we each just pick our favorite and hopefully they're not like, I'll pick one and if. And then you have to pick one of the other two. And I'm sorry for the third person who's going to get kind of screwed here, you know, like, we get two, there still has to be somebody left out, but I think.

A

Well, it's just bad. Yeah, I do like the seniors who aren't going to get a fifth year. It's just bad timing.

B

Exactly, exactly. By the way, there's a hearing going on today that maybe we'll talk about next week because there's another lawsuit and another temporary injunction because that's nonstop in college football. So Dan Maloof, I'm going to give him a gift card this week. I know this is not his first either, and maybe he'll decide to pay it forward. You don't have to. Don't feel obligated, Dan. But because his question fits so nicely on realignment day, I'm going to give Dan Maloof in Washington D.C. a shout out and a. And a gift card.

A

Glad you did that because that frees it up for the one that I was going to push for, and that's Ryan McGuire in San Francisco with the weird, absurd off field events that changed college football history. And thank goodness Bobby Petrino came to mind because if it hadn't, we would have gotten 8 million emails of how could you forget this? So both of you send your mailing addresses to the audible pod at gmail com. For everybody else, I mean, look, there are $16 Trader Joe's gift cards just up for grabs now. So if that shouldn't motivate, I think the issue is we're starting to get too many repeats. So we need some new blood. So send your questions to theaudiblepod at gmail com and we'll see you next time.