A

Today's episode is a little different because my team member Shauna is taking over the host seat and interviewing me about the preschool Autism Summit. We talk about how the summit got started, why I'm so passionate about supporting educators of young autistic children, and the ripple effect of what happens when we come together and learn and grow. If you've ever wondered about the story behind the summit and the mission that drives it, I think you'll really enjoy this conversation.

B

Foreign.

A

I'm Tara Phillips, and this is the Autism Little Learners podcast where I share simple neuroaffirming tools to support young autistic children with compassion and confidence.

B

Okay, welcome back to the Autism Little Learners podcast. You might notice this is not the voice of Tara Phillips. Hi, Tara.

A

Hello.

B

Hello. So I'm Shauna. I'm from Tara's team, and we thought it would be fun today to flip the script and I could ask Tara some questions, interview you for a change. What do you think?

A

I am so excited, but also it's a little more nerve wracking to be in this seat.

B

Well, let's see how it goes. We'll give you a taste of your own interview medicine. Okay, so I'm really excited to ask you some questions, and if you see me looking over here, I'm just reading them. So what was the turning point when you realized that traditional classroom resources weren't meeting the needs of many autistic students? And what motivated you to start Autism Little Learners?

A

That is a great question. So the first half of my career, I was at the elementary level. Second half was early childhood. And back when I was at the elementary level, stock starting in what Carrie Ebert and I call the 1900s, there were not online resources, there were not memberships or like virtual courses, things like that. And it really was, you make all of your own materials. There wasn't a whole lot out there specifically for our students, especially with students with maybe some higher support needs. When I got into the early childhood level, so 3 and 4 year olds, 5, 3, 4, 5 year olds, it became even more apparent that there was absolutely nothing at that level. And so a lot of times by that time teachers pay teachers was around and so I would find resources and I'm like, oh, this is gonna be so great for my students. And I buy it and I download it, I'm like, oh, shoot. You know, I could only see so much of it and I didn't realize it's just wasn't at that level. And also it was more flashcard based instead of bright, colorful activities. That seemed to be more of a match for three to four year olds. So that was the whole reason I started thinking then in those last probably five years as an educator in the classroom at early childhood, I started thinking, okay, I'm making my own resources anyway for my classroom, making my own curriculum. Teachers pay teachers is here. Maybe someone else could use what I'm making.

B

That's incredible. It sounds so. It sounds a little bit like back in the 1900s. I know it was really isolating to be a teacher, like, and not have access to this kind of resources, so.

A

Oh, gosh. And I still have hear from teachers and SLPs where they're like the only one or two in their whole school that does what they do every day in and out of the classroom. And that's how I was literally. I started out in 1999 running a K to 5 autism focused classroom. And so the first year I had four students, I had two paraprofessionals, and it was like, okay, figure it out. And I think from what I'm hearing, that is still the case.

B

Oh, man. Well, good that we have autism little learners. Now, was there a particular student experience or early experience in your career that shaped the way you support autistic children today?

A

Absolutely. Well, there were so many, especially that first crew of kids in that K through 5 program who are now in their 30s. They really impacted me because I feel like they taught me how to be a teacher. And I've always had this unique position. I'm a speech language pathologist. My minor is early childhood education. And so I was put into a classroom where it was a communication based classroom. So I did kind of the job of an SLP and a special educator for. For a lot of my career. And so I was with these students all day. And I'm not kidding when I say they taught me. I taught them their parents. Like, we all work together as a team and I think a lot of those students were the initial impact. And we didn't have terms and words for things like deep interests and all of these things that we look at in hopefully a really positive light now. But you kind of were like, okay, I know. Like, I have one student, he loves the book about cookies week, and we're going to read that book over and over. He had it memorized. And we just started with that every day because we knew that he loved it and it helped him be more regulated when he came into class. So I think that first group of kids. But I also had a student that did a lot of head Banging and self injurious behavior. And it was really hard. And I remember one day I was alone with him and he was banging his head on the floor and I, in my 20s, and I, I just hugged him and held him in. And I remember tears coming down my cheeks like I was not, I was trying not to cry, but they just kind of, you know, when they sprinkle down and I remember saying out loud, how can I help you? How can I help you? It was this moment of like, we need to learn from them non verbally. You just through watching and figuring it out. There's no manual that's going to tell you how to get through those moments. And so I hope with autism little learners that I can bring some of that experience to others.

B

Well, and I think that's what's so powerful about what you've built because it's almost like this community of those isolated teachers finally finding each other. Because, like, even explaining that moment to another teacher at your school would be difficult because their teaching experience is so different.

A

Yeah. And the perspective and the lens is different. And in inside of autism little learners, whether people are a member or in kind of the broader community sharing those stories so people don't feel isolated, we always say, like, like you're on an island. That's what you feel like. And I think that has been a gift that I didn't expect. When I started this, I literally just wanted to share these resources. I did not set out to have a podcast and, you know, a membership. It just started out with resources, but then people were like, okay, well how would you use this? And then it went into, how would you set up your classroom? How would you, you know, went deeper and deeper. And I just felt this calling and it became my passion to help others figure out things that took decades to figure out.

B

Yes. Okay. When you first started sharing resources online, did you ever imagine that it would grow into this community and the movement that it's become?

A

No. Kind of like we just talked about. I thought, I'll just keep making themed resources that are cute. And I always would test them out in my classroom and tweak them and, you know, get them out to everybody, make them cuter, polish them up so that they were sellable. Right. But it was those questions that I got from people. People that felt like they were alone and they just didn't know what to do in their classroom to make it feel like it was smoother, running smoother. There's so many things layered on educators with feeling like you have to have classroom management skills and you are in charge of training paraprofessionals, but they don't give you time to train paraprofessionals and paraprofessionals who want to learn more, but again, they're thrown into the classroom and are like, all right, do your job. And it's always been that way. I've not been in any place where there's been like, very, very, very good ongoing training, but I'm hoping to change that a little bit.

B

I think you are. And I think, like, if you think back to the 20 year old version of yourself in that moment, struggling with the student, like, it would have been so powerful to just be able to tune into a community like the one that you've built and say, like, I just had this horrible day and I like, can somebody please share with me what I could do to make this better? Like, I think that's incredible.

A

And I think for people to be able to talk to another person, whether it's virtual or on the keyboard that understands that moment so that you don't feel like you're a failure, because everyone, I guarantee you could be, could relate to that moment that I had with that student and they could say, it's not you, you're doing the right things. It's that kind of thing. Because we get so hard on ourselves because we want our students to be safe and happy and regulated at school. And when we're trying all the things and it still doesn't work, that's where, like, the wisdom of a collective community is the magic.

B

Priceless. Okay, how did the idea of Preschool Autism Summit first come about and what problem were you hoping it would solve for educators and families? So just quickly, Preschool Autism Summit is this incredible opportunity each year where we bring everybody together and share all sorts of expertise. Brilliant idea. Where did that start?

A

I think the more that I did online with like teaching and training and the more I learned from other people. So whether it's your favorite people on Instagram who you learn from in little nuggets of wisdom and ideas and information, I was like, what if we could bring them all together but at the preschool level? Because I will tell you this, shauna, in my 10 years at the preschool level, training does not relate. Like, if there's a district wide training, even if it's about autism, which, like, rarely happens, it is not at the three and four year old level. And so a lot of times it doesn't apply. Even though it's about autism, it doesn't apply because it's it's you. It's a whole different set of skills at the early childhood level. And yeah, some things you can kind of like, oh, I can generalize that or I can tweak that a bit, but who wants to have to always have the training where you're the last one thought of and you have to tweak everything? Not me. And so I thought this was just a couple years ago because the first summit was in 2024, so two years ago. So I think maybe six months late, 2023, I started thinking like, this would be really fun and valuable to bring all these thought leaders together at the preschool level and have a mix of SLPs, OTs, autistic adults. Who am I missing?

B

Paraprofessionals.

A

Oh, special education teachers. Yeah. Yeah. We should actually have a paraprofessional next year at the summit to talk.

B

Yeah.

A

So having all of these professionals that work with kids, autistic kids during the day, come together and share with each other and this bigger platform where people don't have to pay to fly somewhere or pay to, you know, like back in the day, back in the 1900s, early 2000s, there was not online training. And so our district would maybe once a year, maybe twice if you were lucky, pay for you to go, like, I live in Wisconsin, but I'm right by St. Paul, Minneapolis, Minnesota. So they pay for you to go to like a one day workshop or sometimes you would travel like three hours away somewhere else and you'd. They'd stuff all the female teachers in one room. Like you'd have four or five teachers in one room overnight.

B

Yeah.

A

You've probably all been there. If you're listening and you've taught long enough, you've probably done that to save money. But this, you don't have to worry about any of that travel and all of that nonsense.

B

Yeah. You get access from the comfort of your own home.

A

Yes.

B

Yeah. So powerful.

A

Yeah.

B

And it makes it so easy to like take everything in and really be able to utilize it when like the travel and all of the other part is not part of the equation. So maybe you feel like you've answered this already, but what makes preschool Autism Summit different from a traditional conference or professional development experience? First and foremost, no cold ballroom, no weird, weird sandwiches in the middle of the day.

A

You know, yes, you can get up multitask if you want to, but yeah, I think the main difference is that it is at that preschool level. And that is huge for any of you out there that work at that preschool level. It's applicable for sure to early elementary too. The other piece is that we have a group of autistic adults who watch every single presentation while they review the slides. And then they watch every presentation to make sure that it's neuroaffirming. So that when we say this is a neuroaffirming summit, it is. And who better than the people with lived experience who can share. Share that. Share their lived experience, share their wisdom about themselves as an autistic individual?

B

And what I love too. Now, this isn't specific to the content, but you have made it so easy to access. Like, you can watch a video online. You know, there's so many ways that you can take it with you and learn, like lounge and learn. And it's happening in the summer this year. So just hang out in your lounge chair, enjoy some sun, and listening to a great presentation. Like, I just think that sounds a whole lot better than like five ladies in a hotel room to me, you know?

A

Yeah, I mean, there is that fun social part and the weird stuff that always seems to happen, but it is nice, especially during the summer, to not have to give up your time like that. And that's why we offer also two different options. There's a free option where you're like, okay, I'm available those days. I'm going to take it all in these three days. And then there's the paid option, the all access pass, where you are able to pay a small price to be able to have access throughout the whole year so that you can spread it out or you can come back to it. Be like, okay, now I have a student that this presentation in particular, I need to come back to it because I have a child who we think is pda, has a PDA profile. I'm going to watch Amber Arrington's PDA presentation. And also one of the biggest things we say is use these. If you have the all access pass, use it to train your team. If you're able to, if you have a lunch together, do a lunch and learn and put on a half hour presentation.

B

Yeah, smart. Oh, and with the All Access pass, you can get general certificates of completion.

A

Yes. Okay. I know as an educator, we all need our certificates of completion. So in the all access pass, you have that for every single presentation, which

B

is like more than 25 this year. I feel like.

A

Yeah, it's a lot.

B

It.

A

It adds up to a lot. Yeah, I think we have 30 presentations and maybe a couple other, like live events. Too exciting.

B

Okay. Over the years, what stories or moments from the summit attendees have had the biggest impact on you. Personally,

A

I think there's like, way too many to name, but as soon as

B

I asked it, I was like, whoa, that's overwhelming.

A

But it's kind of two things. There's like the theory part of it, or like learning strategies, and then there's the making things and walking away with something you can use in the classroom right away. So I love seeing all the screenshots or the pictures that people post of after I do every day, I do a make and take with whoever wants to be there. First night, it's with anyone. So even if you have a free ticket, you have the ability to experience a free make and take session with me. And then the next three days, it's, if you have an all access pass, you can join me live and we do some more make and takes. So if that's something you love, that is a perk of the all access pass because you'll be able to leave with, like, all these things that we've made together. But I love seeing the pictures of what people make. And some people have been in summer school or ESY during summit week, and they actually put them into action with kids and get wins right away. Like the all done bucket. That one. I've heard people say they'll post it and they're like, oh, my gosh, this was like a miracle. He put the iPad in the all done bucket right when I asked or right when I put it out. And so it helped with transitions. And it's just amazing to see that shot now.

B

Well, and that's the power of collective wisdom. Right? Like, that's where it's powerful to get people together and say, okay, what's working?

A

Yeah, amazing.

B

Okay.

A

And I think the other piece, Shauna, is on that more theory, strategy, thinking, learning side. It's hearing people say their aha moments. And so we've done a lot with, like, why hand over hand prompting is not the best go to for prompting and how autistic adults have said that in particular can be traumatizing over time. And hearing people say, wow, I've never thought of it like that. I'm. I'm changing what I'm doing starting now. And that happens every year, multiple times.

B

Okay. Not on the script, but just as a P.S. for me because, you know, it's all about me. It's so heartwarming to see all of these educators come together. So I have dyslexia. I had a lot of support in school, good and bad experiences with that. But it's so amazing to now see the other side of the exchange, to see, like, all of these professionals coming together, trying to find the right solutions for students and really have the best experience for the student at heart. Like, it just is so amazing. So, yeah, I agree. Those aha moments are like, they're. I don't know. It's undescribable. It's just wonderful to witness and to be a part of, you know.

A

Oh, thanks for sharing your story. I know we've talked about that some. And the other thing I found is that all of the people that attend the summit, like, everyone is on the same team, and it's just a really uplifting place to be and having this number of people that are connecting and not judging each other. Because there's things that we talk about over the years, too, like language. Language shifts. And so now it's preferred to say a child is autistic versus a child with autism. Well, every year we have a lot of people come in that are still saying, with autism because they didn't know. Like, how would you be able to change your language and update it if you didn't know? Like, this might be the first seed planted about that. And I had that moment with a parent once, and it wasn't all that long ago, maybe six, seven years ago. And she, in the IEP meeting said, I want language in the IEP to say that people will say he's autistic. It's part of who he is. It's not something he carries with him and can set aside. It's part of who he is. And so those kind of shifts, the first exposure to it. I'm hoping that's what this summit does for people.

B

Yeah, well. And I think one of the most valuable ways that you have layered that in is bringing in autistic adults and really making space for them to share their experience, to be part of the entire process and, you know, give us direction on what is helpful and what is not from their perspective. You know, that's super powerful.

A

Yeah.

B

Okay. Many teachers have tried countless programs and strategies. What do you believe is the missing piece that many approaches overlook?

A

I've seen so many approaches over 25 years plus, I have seen very much. When I started out, there were a lot of really, really behavioral approaches. And they. I tried stuff because we would learn, and, you know, they'd say, this is the way you should do it. This is the gold standard. And so I would try stuff, and it would never sit right with me. So I had a student using Pecs at one time. And he was young and he. He got it, like, he could assemble. First it was just giving one picture, and then he could use a sentence strip with the stationery I want. So he would put on the picture and we would say. We'd hold it up and say, I want crackers. And that would be great. And once he got that really well, the next piece in the protocol then was to. I would say up the ante. So if the I want was already on the strip, we would take that off and he'd need to put both of those on. And the way we were taught to do it is hand over hand. Well, every time we upped the ante for this child in particular, it was a change, right? He had just gotten used to, like, okay, he got the thing he wanted, he got it for one picture. Then we upped the ante and he had to put it on the strip. And then after he got. We could put the two on the strip. Then later we upped the ante again to add in like a color, like, or a number. I want two crackers. And every time we. I can't think of a better word layman's terms than up the ante. But whenever we'd up the ante, then he would have enormous behaviors like these crackers that he wanted. He would smash, smash, smash all over the table, swipe them off. And, like, it just felt yucky. And I say this a lot because Terry, who I co taught with in the last 10 years, in the early childhood level, she and I would say to each other, if it feels yucky, don't do it. Right, yes, that's following your gut. But if you didn't have an alternative, like, I didn't have an alternative. Someone teaching, like, maybe more neural firming strategies, you wouldn't know. You would just think you're failing somehow. So I think that story in particular is that yucky feeling, that gut feeling from early on in my career. But we didn't know what to call it. And now I know more. And I think relationships. So connection with students is the number one besides regulation, right? Child's dysregulated, they're not going to be learning. And it's hard to make a connection with you if they're on the floor, dysregulated or shutting down. So regulation and then connection right beside it. And connection for me really looks like finding out what they love and incorporating it, not using it as a way to get them to do what you want at, like, hey, you do Five math problems, and then you get to have your paw patrol character. Dinosaur, whatever. But more so. Okay. He loves dinosaurs. I know this not because he told me, but because it's what he goes to every day. Right. When he gets to class.

B

Right.

A

How can I incorporate dinosaurs into all his goals and that. Well, actually that at the 2026 summit this year, that's what I'm speaking about. Our deep interest, incorporating them into learning activities. I might have veered way off on that question, Shana. I'm sorry.

B

That's okay. It feels like the difference between the two just feels like in the first example, you're constantly moving the bar so you never totally win. And who wouldn't get frustrated with that? You're changing the rules on me all of the time versus I know you love this. Let's make these things that we're doing together about the things you love too, so that it's like a little bit more interesting. So that's awesome. I think. Okay, I'm going to do one more question. When you think about where you started, a classroom teacher trying to help a handful of students and where you are today, having the impact of thousands of educators and families and students around the world, what emotions come up for you? What gives you hope about the future in this field?

A

It's such a good question. It kind of makes me feel a little emotional because I spent 25 years in the classroom working with autistic children and never once did I think about leaving the classroom. I didn't think, oh, I want to go start a business and, you know, leave the classroom. That was not a thought that was ever in my mind. What I did think was, how can I help other people just in little groups. I was in sharing resources. And then it turned into me sharing resources online, which opened it up. But I would have never, ever guessed, like the global impact that one person can have with something they're passionate about that other people need or could relate to. And so it was not my goal to leave the classroom. In fact, three years ago today, I was preparing for summer school. So I've been out of the classroom less than three years. And it just got to the point where I had to choose because I can't work two full, full, full time jobs. We know teaching is more than a full time job. And the reward of this has been being able to impact kids all around the country and all around the world with neuroaffirming strategies through their incredible educators who have a growth mindset and want to learn more and want to Learn how to do better or just add one little thing that can change their day so that they have a better day. Because this is a really stressful and challenging job. And I think we say this about students. They would if they could. And it's the same thing with all of us as adults. Like, we would do better if we could, if we knew better strategies. And so I'm really hoping this summit can bring those to people.

B

That's amazing. Well, it's been incredible to talk to you about this. It's been always incredible to be part of the team and to help you to get this message out there to people I love. Like, we're about to have the summit again this year. And for every teacher that comes, or SLP, paraprofessional parent, on average, we are also reaching about 10 students. So, you know, that's an incredible impact to have.

A

Yeah, that's kind of our little estimate of, okay, if one teacher signs up for the free ticket.

B

Yeah.

A

And they have 10 students, we're impacting 10 students. Now imagine 10,000 people sign up for the free ticket. That's 100,000 students. If 50,000, it's 500,000 students. And I have this, like, funny goal inside of me is like, I want to reach a million students, because in the classroom, how many could I impact? You know, six. It depends on the year. With how many students you have. Six in the morning and six in the afternoon. So it's. That is a wild. A wild thought. And it's all of us together. It's the speakers, it's the people attending the summit. Like, this is a movement that we are all creating together to get the word out about neuroaffirming strategies for autistic kids.

B

So where can our friends find out about their free ticket and join us for the Preschool Autism Summit?

A

Yes. So if you're listening, there'll be a link in the show notes, but you can also go to preschoolautismsummit.com and same thing, if you're watching this over on YouTube, we'll have links in there. Or you can go to preschoolautismsummit.com Amazing.

B

All right, well, Tara, it's been lovely to chat with you. Thanks for letting me host on the show. Very fun taking over. Yeah, no worries. And we're excited. Everyone come and join us at the summit so we can take care of you and then you can take great care of your students.