Dave Asprey

I used to manufacture a gloppy orange

thing when I was at Bulletproof. This is different. It's not a pill. It doesn't taste great and it doesn't enter the cell that well, but it's better than nothing. So you just put a little bit in the spray on. But because it absorbs into the cells effectively, you get the benefits on your face and you can see the difference. It does work. You use it for a month, you'll notice it. But I just spray the oral wellness on my basically abdomen and rub it in and it goes in and then my cell amounts go up more than they would from an IV, which is ridiculous.

Dr. Nayan Patel

It's usually about 2 to 300 milligrams, which are about 8 to 12 sprays of the Gluteril.

Dave Asprey

You're listening to the Human Upgrade with Dave Asprey.

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This episode is recorded at the studios here in Austin, Texas. And our guest today is Dr. Nayan Patel, who is not a first timer on the show, but is one of the most brilliant humans I know at figuring out how to get supplements into the body so they actually work. So every time we have a conversation, it's about some molecule that you may or may not have heard of, but it's about how does it actually work. And the basics of biohacking are really straightforward. You know, you probably should be circadian aligned. Might've been saying that since, you know, those first red glasses years ago with truedark. And you probably should know how to eat right and learn how to manage your stress and take some breaths or meditation or something. Those are Table 6. And then you say, but you should also get your nutrients. But that's where it gets really interesting because, oh, which nutrients? And then you take them and then, well, they don't go in and we get kind of stuck there. And so there's a lot of noise in the market because this is going to sound really crazy, but everyone who sells any supplement will tell you theirs is special. But most of them are made at the same manufacturing plants and they're not that special. So Dr. Patel is here and we're going to go really deep on a couple things that I think are most important. One of them is glutathione. The second or third blog post I ever wrote about health was about glutathione. And there's a lot we know now that we didn't. And we'll talk about copper and we're going to talk about some other compounds you may not know about. Dr. Patel, welcome back to the show.

Dr. Nayan Patel

Thank you for having me here.

Dave Asprey

I call you a doctor, but you're really a pharmacist.

Dr. Nayan Patel

I'm a pharmacist, yes.

Dave Asprey

So this is going to sound kind of dumb because I have lots of doctor friends and a few pharmacist friends. Why do they call you a doctor if you're a pharmacist?

Dr. Nayan Patel

Well, it's just a degree. Right. I did doctor in pharmacy. So, you know, it's polite thing to say that part, but normally it's a personal touch. Right. Why do people wear lab coats? White coats. There's a barrier. It's a marketing. It's a barrier between the patients and the professionals. And just there's a certain authority that's been implied. Authority. And same thing with doctor, but I would prefer just nayen.

Dave Asprey

Just naye. That works for me. And we've traveled in the Antarctic together in Michelle, so we're friends as well guys, if you can't tell. But I like smart friends. So let's talk about glutathione. What's new in the world of glutathione since you were on about a year ago talking about it.

Dr. Nayan Patel

All right, so it's been 40 years that we know about glutathione. As you said, your, your first, first few blog posts was on glutathione. It's, it's the foundation of every single thing. So we think that we know everything about glutathione and I think we know a lot about glutathione today. What we do not know it's, which is new to me is that how much misinformation that's out there that is not allowing our patients to actually see the full benefits of full potential of glutathione.

Dave Asprey

Hold on, did you just use a Nazi era propaganda word you did? Which one was information is a bullshit term. It doesn't mean anything. And it's just saying that the other guys are intentionally lying to deceive and you don't know that. So how about they're just wrong? Incorrect information. Incorrect can get behind that. Misinformation is a tool of tyrants and Mind washers. I know you're better than that.

Dr. Nayan Patel

Of course. Now let's just cut that one off. Okay, Perfect. I think it's, it's. There's no ill intention about this thing at all. It's just that the knowledge base does not exist.

Dave Asprey

People, they don't understand it.

Dr. Nayan Patel

They don't understand that part. And I do not understand that either myself, because I was making IV form of glutath. I made liposome form of glutathione because 25 is 26 years years ago. Yeah, I did not know any better either.

Dave Asprey

It was the best we had. And it worked better than taking it orally. You couldn't take it any other way, Right?

Dr. Nayan Patel

Exactly. And it worked. It. It did work. The thing is, did it give me the full benefit? And that's the reason I was starting to talk about today. Because, for example, Dave, let's see, you have this beautiful house that you're running. Let's see, it cost you $10,000 to run this house. And you only get 8,000 bucks every month. Can you still run the house?

Dave Asprey

Probably, yeah. Not for long periods of time, but you can.

Dr. Nayan Patel

But you're going to make some cuts. And those cuts adds up to. Eventually the house gets deteriorated and gets crumbled up. Imagine our body needs glutathione every single day. And the demands are not meet. If the demands are not met ever. And there's always a shortfall. And most supplements are unfortunately not getting 200% need absorption. Absorptions or not. Not meeting all your demands. And I mean, we met Dr. Palmetto at heartache trip as well. And he, and he's injecting how much? 5 and 10,000mg on Parkinson's patients. And when I told him about the topical version, that you can get the same result with 100, 200 milligrams, first of all, he shake his head, yeah. And then the next thing goes, oh my God, this is crazy. And then he realized, oh my God, it's not how much you give is how much your body's actually getting it.

Dave Asprey

Yeah. And he's a very open minded, scientific guy. Just, just came through 40 years in with his wife, leaves is Dr. David Perlmutter. Yeah, we were together in the Antarctic. And yeah, it's, it's important. When I was really intoxic, Well, I did 4 grams of glutathione in an IV because it's the only way I could get it and it's expensive and all that, but no one at the time could even Measure how much got inside the cells. And really that's what works. It's not having it floating around, it's having it inside and used. But what I want to know is Caveman didn't have this. So we make our own glutathione. What's going on? Why do we need so much more?

Dr. Nayan Patel

Well, the thing is, our body can produce plenty until the last day. There's no issue about not producing enough. It's just our demands never go down.

Dave Asprey

The demands are maybe higher too, because we might not be living in the idyllic mother nature world of no toxins, right?

Dr. Nayan Patel

Unfortunately, yes. And that's one of the modern day conveniences. We cannot live without it. We are trying to limit as much as possible, but we're not going to zero. So that means, guess what? There's always going to be that. This amount of oxidative stress, exposure to toxic chemicals, exposure to products, that our body is not able to process it correctly. When that happens, our needs are going to be there forever. Our needs actually stay stagnant, or the same in some cases also increases because you pick up behaviors, because you always progress life and you pick up people, pick up behaviors that are not conducive for healthy aging.

Dave Asprey

Okay.

Dr. Nayan Patel

And so that, that's one of the reasons why our needs have never decreased.

Dave Asprey

Got it. And actually, as you age, you get more senescent cells that make more reactive oxygen species. And to counter those, you would need more glutathione. And your glutathione production possibly goes down. Right.

Dr. Nayan Patel

But see, the thing is, Dave, you brought up a point about senescent cells. Senescent cells is a tertiary marker and the body's trying to adapt to try to reduce oxygen stress markers. And initially there's no senescent cells. When you're young, what happens at that later age? Because the body cannot keep up with it with the demands or the removal of all the toxic cells. And guess what it's doing? It is forcing it out. It's a third measure, and it's still a very healthy way to get rid of it. So there's nothing wrong with that portion

Dave Asprey

of the what's the healthy way? You're saying glutathione, what gets rid of the senescent cells that you're talking about?

Dr. Nayan Patel

No, the senescent ce. It's. It's the body's defense system that kicks in. Right. But before that, if there's enough of the glutathione built into the system, you don't get. We do not net, we don't need that part. But as we age, we. I mean, we. Let me be frank. Nobody's perfect.

Dave Asprey

Yeah.

Dr. Nayan Patel

And so we did. We need every single thing. We need senolytics, we need glutathione, we need every different modalities just so that we can keep in shape.

Dave Asprey

It's kind of cool because at with unlimited life, this is a high end concierge VIP longevity medicine group that I'm a partner in and we've got people flying in from all over the world and we run $50,000 worth of lab work including markers of senescence. And when we put people on glutathione, and yes, I like your Aura Wellness product. And we put them on all the other things of senolytics. We're seeing most people in their 50s and above have high levels of senescent cells and some people have dropped 70% in one year because we're actually quantifying everything. And you can do that. And a lot of people don't understand, okay, you know, zombie cells, you read that probably in my book. And here's what zombies do though. In the body, they walk around, they make other zombies. So senescent cells send out something called sasp, which is a signaling molecule and it causes your tissues to form weak tissues.

Now your collagen is no good, your

fascia is no good. Your muscle quality goes down, your skin quality goes down. And if you can have enough glutathione before senescence, you have less zombies. And those zombies, well, they won't send out the signal that says make, you know, tofu Crete mussels instead of making them out of proper cement with rebar. And you know, my evidence for this, just on a personal basis, I just did. I had my pre novo scan. I read on a recent, recent episode. And the doc who was reading it, Sean says, dave, of all the influencers of any age, you have the least fat in your muscle of anyone. Like, it's because I manage my senescent cells and also well, I use a lot of glutathione and I have for 25 years because I'm early to this thing. So, yeah, I have definitely switched to using your product, the Aura Wellness glutathione, probably three years ago when you talked about your water channel delivery technology. And guys, this is different. It's not a pill and it's not like a gloppy orange thing. And I used to manufacture a gloppy orange thing when I was at Bulletproof. Newsflash by danger, nothing to do with bulletproof anymore, but it doesn't taste good. And it works reasonably well with liposuct gums, but it's a lot of bulk, doesn't taste great, and it doesn't enter the cell that well, but it's better than nothing. So now that I just spray the aura wellness on my basically abdomen and rub it in and it goes in and then my cell amounts of glutathione go up more than they would from an iv, which is ridiculous.

Dr. Nayan Patel

It is ridiculous. And that's the part I couldn't understand myself either when I first discovered this thing, is that there's no way. Yeah, it is absolutely no way they can be that easy.

Dave Asprey

I thought you were full of b.

Dr. Nayan Patel

I didn't believe myself. I didn't take the product myself either. And it's one of those things that it is too good to be true. And then I realized that, hey, our job as a scientist is not to create new science. It's to observe things in life that are simple and it's readily available to us. And I was able to observe how the body was absorbing glutathione naturally using dextrin molecule. And when I did that part, I discovered a whole new transport systems. Because until now, if you transfer nutrients inside your body, you stick into your bloodstream, you take a pill and it gets to the hepatic portal and you basically get into the bloodstream. And that's how you measure. If you want to see how much magnesium you have in the body, you do a blood test and you figure how much magnesium you have in the body. When it comes to glutathione, we found out there's a cell to cell transfer. And that was something absolutely brand new. Dr. Joe Maroon, the. The neuroscientist at NFL, and he was applying and he did his own study. He was his patient himself. I said, man, I couldn't figure out how on the Herc. He's 80 plus years old doing iron mans. How is that possible that I've been doing all these treatments and your product is actually getting into my brain cells? And so what he did was he applied on his arms, put himself in the MRI machine and see his brain lit up with glutathione within 15, 20 minutes. And he published the data already.

Dave Asprey

That's real. And anytime this stuff happens, it creates a disruptive change in the longevity movement. So similar things have been happening with NAD where it used to be. You're gonna spend $10,000 to get a course of 10 or 20 NAD IVs, and there's some oral forms that are bringing the levels inside the cells up. So we know a molecule's important. We brute force it into the body. Then we develop laboratory analytics to see how it's getting into the cells. And it can enter different cells differently. And then we go back and we clean up the delivery technologies. And what you did is you discovered, because you're a pharmacist, you understand biochemistry in a very brilliant way. Like, oh, here's. Here's a way that ought to work better. And you tested it, and it does work better. So unfortunately, the people who are doing the Glutathione IVs are probably not as happy about it. But I will also say, if I have a needle in my arm, I'll give some glutathione. I don't have a problem with it. Yeah, but I'm less reliant on that because I know my levels are high just because I use the oral spray, which is really easy.

Dr. Nayan Patel

So IVs is not wrong. It's just that I would not do IV push by itself just for glutathione. That, that, that's, that's. That's stupid, I think. Yeah, but if you're doing iv, let's say if you're new Myers cocktail, and if you do an IV glue, then push at the end, go for it. Because what we do know is the IV is like a reservoir. It breaks down into the cysteine molecule. The cysteine gets absorbed into the bloodstream and then used to produce own glutathione. So you're giving a reservoir of cysteine to the body to keep on making your own glutathione over the next six, eight hours, up to two days.

Dave Asprey

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It's unlike anything else you can buy. It's a true geroprotector, which means it can slow down aging at the cellular level because it helps to strengthen cell membranes. It supports mitochondrial function and helps to regulate key aging pathways. Most people don't get enough C15 from their diet, so levels drop over time. Fatty 15 is a solution Fatty 15 supports healthy aging for everyone from kids to parents to grandparents. That's why it's now available in clean capsules. They also make a delicious apple mint gummy that my teens love. And their Berry blast gummies, well, pretty much kids love those. Doesn't really matter which way you get it as long as you get some of this because your cell membranes need to function that at every stage of life. And the earlier you start, the better off you'll be. Go to fatty15.comdave to get an extra 15% off their 90 day starter kit. Again, that's fatty15.comdave for a simple way to cover what your body's missing. Your hair starts thinning years before you notice it. Biotin gummies, DHT blockers, scalp massagers, most of them don't actually get to the root cause. It's because age related hair thinning starts with senescence cells. You might know them as zombie cells and they build up inside your hair follicles. They accumulate, then they send out inflammatory signals and they disrupt your natural hair growth cycle. And then summer makes it worse. UV exposure, heat, sweat, all of it adds stress to your scalp on top of what's already happening underneath. Once again, built something that addresses age related thinning at the source. And it's something that I use and I see a difference from their OS1 peptide. The same that's in their skin and sun care products is the first ingredient scientists have proven reduces the biological age

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I like using it because, well, it

works, but it also goes on like water. It's not so sticky, there's no residue. You just put it in after a shower before you dry your hair and it works. It stacks cleanly with anything else you're already doing. It works well for men and women because it's not dealing with DHT. And for a limited time you can get one skin with 15% off at OneSkin Co. Dave. And after you purchase, tell them the human upgrade sent you. That's 15% off at oneskin. Go Dave.

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longevity industry right now and Oneskin is one of the brands that's doing really solid longevity work with clinically proven results.

Now there's Been a lot of talk in longevity circles for years about this combination of. They call it glynac, G L, Y N, A C. It's glycine and antacetylcysteine. And glycine is a common amino acid. You might be familiar with it if you like collagen, which I made into a billion dollar business because its primary amino acid is glycine. So glycine has longevity things. Too much glycine is actually bad for you, though. And then nac, N acetylcysteine. This is a precursor. It's what we used to take with vitamin C to make glutathione when we didn't have another choice. But a lot of studies show the combination of glycine and NAC has really profound longevity effects. Is that just because they're glutathione precursors or is there something else going on?

Dr. Nayan Patel

That's exactly what is. And the same Dr. Maroon that we talked about earlier, all the decades he was using the Glynek product, exact same product. And when he just used it for like less than a month, he couldn't believe how much things he can start remembering things at the age of 80 plus started getting the memory back. He was at. This was so profound in his whole life that he actually started studying the oral wellness gluteal in in place of Glynek for all his data now.

Dave Asprey

Wow.

Dr. Nayan Patel

This just happened about a year and a half ago, literally.

Dave Asprey

Here's something that's important to know about glycine. So people say, oh, glycine is good. I'll just take a lot of glycine. Well, there's something called the gly ox was glyox pathway. Glyoxylytic. What's that pathway? Do you remember its name?

Dr. Nayan Patel

I don't know. The negotiat.

Dave Asprey

Exactly. It's the pathway that takes it straight into oxalate.

Dr. Nayan Patel

Yep.

Dave Asprey

So if you take 10, 20, 30 grams of glycine and the odds are it'll form razor sharp calcium crystals just like you ate a bunch of spinach, kale, and almonds. And the other things that we know now are very well associated with diseases of aging because 87% of people who are 80 have calcium oxalate, razor sharp crystals in their thyroids, and it's throughout the rest of the body. So this builds up over time metabolically from excess glycine. So my upper limit for glycine would be about 3 grams a day. And some people do great on N acetylcysteine. In fact, it's also associated with longevity. But also a lot of us have problems with sulfur metabolism. So you take too much n acetylcysteine and you take too much glycine. You've created inflammation and negative tissue remodeling and maybe some glutathione. So you gotta be careful with the precursors.

Dr. Nayan Patel

True.

Dave Asprey

But here's my question for you. I'm getting a little bit technical, but I think our listeners care about this because they just want to. What should I do, guys? What you should do is to take glutathione, spray it on because it works better. It's ro wellness. And was it code Dave? I'm sure I do. Oh, no, it's R o A u r o wellness.com Dave. There you go. Get a discount. But here's what to understand. Some people who have histamine problems and people who sneeze a lot have problems with mast cell. Anyone with long Covid or toxic molds. And we have people here with a lot of practitioners too, who know about this stuff. Sometimes they have a problem with sulfur metabolism.

Dr. Nayan Patel

Yep.

Dave Asprey

There it's called suox s u o x. That pathway that breaks down sulfur. It can be genetic or it can just be from eating a lot of sulfur. If you're taking precursors to glutathione or taking lots of it orally, you get a lot of sulfur, which then could drive the histamine response. So maybe it wasn't this mean it was the sulfur. If I'm spraying the oro glutathione on what is my sulfur load versus taking precursors?

Dr. Nayan Patel

So, okay, so let me break it down the sulfur thing, because this is a very common question. Cysteine smells like sulfur. It's because of the thiol group, sits on cysteine. It is not a sulfur drug. So if it's sulfur allergies, you can still take glutathione or cysteine and no issues whatsoever. But you're right about the sulfur. It's a thiol group that's inside the cysteine. So when you spray the glutathione, it has the same thiol group, but the thiol group is combined with the glycine and glutamine. So it basically becomes a tripeptide instead of just being cysteine by itself doesn't

Dave Asprey

get metabolized like sulfur.

Dr. Nayan Patel

That doesn't get like sulfur. But here's a kicker. When the glutathione kicks in, sometimes it gives you the rash and you think, oh, I because I'm sulfur Allergies or sulfite. But in the reality, it is detoxifying to a pace where your body's not used to it. So it's giving a temporary rash because it's just going too fast.

Dave Asprey

Got it.

Dr. Nayan Patel

To slow it down.

Dave Asprey

And the rash goes away in a few minutes.

Dr. Nayan Patel

The rash goes away as soon as you slow it down. Okay, but here's another thing that you asked me a question. People taking too much cysteine. There is an issue with too much cysteine in your brain cause causes five cystile dopamine complexes. It's, it's, it's another neurotoxic complex that causes Parkinson's.

Dave Asprey

Too much cysteine is associated with Parkinson's. Yeah, So I did not know that.

Dr. Nayan Patel

So the thing is the issue. That's what I was talking to Dr. Palm Butter. I said, hey, what is going on over here? Because what happens is that too much cysteine, it actually causes a complex in the dopamine. And if that complex is causing Parkinson's like symptoms.

Dave Asprey

Oh, is it causing Parkinson's or Parkinson's like symptoms?

Dr. Nayan Patel

Well, we don't know if it's. If they're having shaky movements, they are diagnosed with Parkinson's. And it's just. So the Parkinson's like symptoms is what we can claim it at this point, but that's what's happening now. If you can take it off glutamine. That's why glutamine works, because it combines, it binds to cysteine and gets rid of it. So a little bit of glutamine works, a little bit of glycine works. But you're right about the glycine. Too much glycine can also cause issues. So if you think about it, so this is my brain. I'm not going to call myself genius, but I'm just going to call it what it is. Vitamin C is great for collagen, stimulant

Dave Asprey

up to a certain limit. Because too much vitamin C also drives oxalate.

Dr. Nayan Patel

Exactly. So what I did with my skincare, I added vitamin C to that. I added the glycine, the proline, the valine for body building, collagen right into this topical skincare product. So no excess. When you say three grams, to me, even three grams is too much sometimes. Yes. And so I put a very small amount to build collagen. Superficially gets you all the benefits. And without taking too much of glycine,

Dave Asprey

this is the genius thing, because your skin does need more of that stuff. But if you stuff Your insides full of enough of it, you're going to get the downside of cysteine and the downside of glycine, both of which are good for you, but not too much. So you just put a little bit in the spray on. But because it absorbs into the cells effectively, you get the benefits on your face and you can see the difference. It does work. You use it for a month, you'll notice it.

Dr. Nayan Patel

Yep.

Dave Asprey

Okay, so that, I think, was technical, guys, but I think you got most of it. I'm not telling you to avoid taking glycine or nac. I'm saying you'd want to take small amounts for systemic support. Vitamin C, I can support maybe, maybe a gram a day. In divided doses, you really peak at about 250 milligrams if you do that twice a day. But going up above that a little bit, the tissue, the plasma levels do go up higher. And there's probably some other benefits. But if you're doing, you know, five grams of vitamin C a day, you're probably driving crystal formation in your body and you don't want to do that. So it's like trace amounts of those things at the right ratios. And that brings up something else. We're talking about amino acids here. Wow, this reminds me. Going way back in time, sometimes things just pop into my head. So the original innovators in the modern longevity movement were Dirk Pearson and Sandy Shaw. And these guys were active in the 80s before I was into the field. So I kind of started in the late 90s. But it was on the tail of their influence. And a couple years ago, Dirk Pearson passed away. But they were the original we're going to extend human life things. And they just outraged everyone with all the stuff they were doing. And I was on a flight one time and I sat next to Dirk's best friend and we talked for this whole flight about it. And the guy was much older than I was. And he's saying, you know, it's kind of dark. He goes, if I was running Guantanamo, because all I would do is I'd restrict certain amino acids and all the prisoners would break and tell me everything. And I was like, that is so dark. What are you talking about? He was talking about manipulating the ratios of amino acids in our food, which has profound neurological and biological consequences. And we're all doing that based on our source of protein or the supplements we're taking. We don't know we're doing it. What do you know about amino acid ratios?

Dr. Nayan Patel

Not a whole lot.

Dave Asprey

Not A whole lot. I found something you don't know. My God.

Dr. Nayan Patel

Well, the thing is, you know Dr. Minkoff, of course, yeah.

Dave Asprey

He's been on the show. I use perfect amino and I'm a huge fan. That's the right ratio.

Dr. Nayan Patel

So we do talk about in, in depth. I do ask a lot of questions to him personally because I'm learning.

Dave Asprey

But you're a pharmacist, so.

Dr. Nayan Patel

Yeah, because I'm learning from the, from the point of how can I use amino acids to betterment. Right.

Dave Asprey

So yeah, that's what I'm thinking about.

Dr. Nayan Patel

Mine is all delivery. I, I need to get, if you, if you think are good for you. How can I get into the cells where it needs to be making the peptides? Because at the end of the day we need to make peptides. So to make peptides it needs to be in the right ratio, the right place. Every single thing. And most of the peptides placed are a gut produced. And thing is, if you take it by mouth, the gut destroys all the immune. It'll absorb it gets in the bloodstream and get it back to the gastric tissues as well. So if there's a better way to deliver without going through the gut. That was my whole idea. So I'm asking a lot of questions about amino acids ratios and things like that. The very few that I, you know, we are trained to look for problems, not for solutions. As a pharmacist, shocking. So, so, so I'm always looking for which umeses are causing problems and how, how we can restrict those use. That's what I'm, that's what my knowledge comes in.

Dave Asprey

Got it. So I, I still think that there's, there's more work to be done. Some of the, the things that are very effective that you make, like the copper tripeptide that you've got in the, the topical. Just because you can get stuff into cells in a way that no one else can, as far as I'm saying. And then you've got patented this like it's a genuine new discovery in the world of biohacking and, and even drug delivery. If you wanted it to be so glutamine, what happens if you put. So I think manipulating amino acids in the skin and maybe even inside the cells elsewhere than the skin is a fertile ground for more research. But I imagine you're on that.

Dr. Nayan Patel

I, I am definitely working on that one. So we did, we did. We just got our 14th patent in just last week as well.

Dave Asprey

Congratulations.

Dr. Nayan Patel

Thank you.

Dave Asprey

Wow.

Dr. Nayan Patel

So now we are getting to a point where we are looking at amino acids and see how we can do beauty inside out. I really want to focus on all these different things because more is not better. We already know that part. More is not better. Can we figure out the one thing that I can do to have a major impact now? I understand our body has thousands of different things that we need every single day. We can do thousand things every single day, but there's always one or two things that you can do effectively that's going to change it. The GHK copper we talked about earlier was a whole different animal because GHK is a tripeptor that the body produces naturally. And it's not from day no synthesis. It doesn't produce the three amino acids combined together. It's a fragment of a plasma. And so it's a whole plasma that's created. And then one of the fragments is ghk. And as the plasma gets old, the plasma gets fragmented and it's all dumped out. The GHK is basically reabsorbed into the system combines to copper and it's actually signaling molecule for beauty, for collagen productions and for fine wrinkles and all those things. And so I said, wait a second. If that's the case, maybe I can use my technology to deliver GHK copper into your skin and get the same benefit. The issue was the copper as a metal. My technology works with peptides and this was a metal. So it took me four years to try to figure out how to get around that. The copper, it's an ionic charge on it too. So it was very difficult for me to work on it. But then last year we released it. I was on your podcast discussing about those. At that time it was brand new, so I was still learning about this. But today I'm figuring out a lot more things now.

Dave Asprey

Wow.

Dr. Nayan Patel

It is getting to a point where it's become the ultra beauty Peptide is what we talk about today.

Dave Asprey

And I've been using GHK or copper tripeptide for about 15 years now. And when I first I got into peptides before they were the current trend they are now. And this is one of the foundational ones. And it was usually sold for and put a few drops in your serum. I'm like, that's probably not getting it. And I tried it. So then I would inject. I tried injecting a little bit in the face and face injections hurt. Oh my God, I hated that. It wasn't worth it. And it's also be irritated to get little bumps from Doing it. I'm like, no, I'm not gonna do that. And then I realized, as we age, we all talk about how NAD drops linearly with time. Well, GHK levels drop in plasma with time just as much as NAD does. So I thought, well, why not just do IV GHK to get my levels back up? Maybe that's even why young blood works, because it has GHK in it. So I actually did some intravenous ghk. Only do that with the doctor guys, because it needs not the copper.

Dr. Nayan Patel

This is GHK by itself.

Dave Asprey

It was copper ghk.

Dr. Nayan Patel

Oh, you do copper. Yeah, because people do GHK by itself as well.

Dave Asprey

It's true. In fact, this is a nuance most people don't know. Yeah, you can get GHK or GHK Cu as usually on the label. Which one do you like?

Dr. Nayan Patel

So the GHK CU is much more stable. Yeah, I love GHK by itself, but it's so hard to work with in my lab. I do have both chemicals in my lab. The GHK by itself is extremely difficult to work. It's always in minus 80 degrees C stored.

Dave Asprey

Okay.

Dr. Nayan Patel

And when I take it out, it's like, gets destroyed very, very fast. It's very hard to work with.

Dave Asprey

Okay. Pretty much, for those of us with normal refrigerators, you don't have a choice. We're looking at the GHK copper. So I did do that intravenously, and I don't think we have great protocols for the volume and amount, but I think there's probably a case for systemic use of it. I've seen it orally where it might be active, because if it's on empty stomach. It's a small peptide.

Dr. Nayan Patel

It's a small peptide. But. But the issue with the IV is not so prevalent because the purest form of GHKCU in the world today is 70. 73 pure.

Dave Asprey

Right.

Dr. Nayan Patel

It's 100. What's the rest of it exactly? Amino acids. They don't. Because. Because what? They're. When you look at the COF. When I get my chemical, I get the CFA, it says 99.9 pure GHK KCU. I said, wait a second. How come it has 8% water in there? I said, oh, that. That's hydration factor. What. What about other proteins is in there? Other amino acids? Well, that's. No, we. What we are saying is the GHCU portion is 90% pure. I said, that's what I'm looking at.

Dave Asprey

It's like, what's in the vial.

Dr. Nayan Patel

Is in the vial. What, what's more.

Dave Asprey

And what does pure even mean?

Dr. Nayan Patel

Exactly. So basically when I was launching my product, I had to go back to the manufacturer. I said, I can't use your product. Product is only 70% pure. And plus my product, I want to make sure, because it's getting into your sales and every single thing. So I need to be very, very potent. And the guy goes, well, we cannot make it. I said, I have to use additional techniques to remove some of the impurities out of there. So the best I'm getting right now, the best is 73%. That's. We are the only manufacturers in the world who has this product right Now. We pay 10 times more per gram pricing to get this chemical. Wow.

Dave Asprey

And that's still what you put in the skin serum?

Dr. Nayan Patel

Oh, yeah.

Dave Asprey

I have to, I, I have no choice. That's integrity.

Dr. Nayan Patel

I have no choice. But the thing is, they also, we also had to remove the endotoxins and the pyrogens out of there. And that product, you can actually inject it. But I still will not do it myself because it still has 7, 20, 27% out of 27, 8% water. So it's still a 20, 20% of proteins or amino acids that I don't know what it is.

Dave Asprey

What could go wrong?

Dr. Nayan Patel

What could go wrong? Right.

Dave Asprey

Let's try it and find out.

Dr. Nayan Patel

No. Wow.

Dave Asprey

And you said something really important. And as someone who's formulated a sizable number of supplements and coffees and all this stuff that I'm well known for, there are times when I'm not going to do that. But it makes it more expensive. And when I first started using collagen, you can buy really cheap collagen from industrial animals. Ancient nutrition, non organic chicken, that's just heavy metal glyphosate soup. I wouldn't feel that to my dog. No offense. I'm sure if you're running ancient nutritions, maybe you aren't doing that anymore. But at the time when they launched it, I was like, no, because I was spending a lot on grass fed, you know, low temperature, low molecular weight peptides. Because that's what I wanted people to feel. So my products at the time was like 40, 45 bucks. I was just 25 bucks. And consumers don't know the difference. You're one of the guys who's like, look, I think people are smart enough to pay for quality and there's no one else can get it into the cells anyway the way you do. Yeah, you just you make something that is high integrity and I do appreciate that.

Dr. Nayan Patel

Oh, thank you.

Dave Asprey

Can we Talk about Glutathione vs NAD?

Dr. Nayan Patel

I love NAD supplements. I think there's a time and place for NAD supplements in life. But it has been marketed as the ultimate longevity drug that's out there. And I think so that it is good to have nad. It's not the ultimate, ultimate longer drug, because Nadia is an electron transfer molecule goes from NAD to nadh. And it's absolutely important because without the light switch, guess what? No lights are getting turned on. But the value gets diminished over time. Right? If we have, let's see if we have four light bulbs over here. If you have one switch, you're going to turn up all four light bulbs. What if we have four switches? Well, I can plug every single light bulbs on its own, but the value would not be that high. Two may be better. So as you take more and more nad, the results get lower and lower. But don't get me wrong, you do need to have one. Maybe two is going to get better, right? So NAD is absolutely necessary for you. But NAD is used to produce glutathione. It's the last step. When you combine the three amino acids together, you need two molecules of ATP and one molecule of nad. NAD is there to do the electron transfer. And it is also necessary to go from oxidized glutathione back to the reduced form, the GSSG molecule, go back to GSH with the help of electron transfer again, NAD to NADH to NADH to NAD again, and so on, so forth. So it's like the spring, the wheel. And every time you spin the wheel, it generates electricity for you. So that's what NAD is. Now, without the nad, there's no glutathione. So if you have low NAD levels, your body's not producing glutathione.

Dave Asprey

Interesting, right?

Dr. Nayan Patel

But if you have. If you have enough glutathione levels, then the need for NAD to produce glutathione decreases. But in reality, no glutathione supplementation. Besides, our product is actually being absorbed. So every glutathione product is basically feeding the raw materials. So you don't need NAD as a supplement to go along with it. So it's a great thing.

Dave Asprey

Your doctor said your labs look normal. Okay, then why don't you feel like yourself? Why are you exhausted all the time? Why has your body stopped responding to the things that used to work? That's why gatlin exists. Gatlin is a physician LED optimization program for people who know something is off even when the conventional system says everything looks fine. It's also for people who want more energy, better recovery, better sleep and long term performance. Because the current system system often waits for disease, Most people get 10 minutes with a doctor, a basic blood panel and a vague everything looks normal even when they still feel off. Gatlin does things differently. You speak with a licensed medical provider and you get comprehensive labs. And depending on your needs, your plan may include hormone support, thyroid support, peptide therapy and longevity focused care personalized around your actual biology. Not one size fits all methods. Medicine. Feeling off shouldn't be dismissed just because it's common. Start your journey today@gatlin.com Dave and use code Dave that's G-A-T-L-A-N.com Dave Code Dave

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And if you've flown around the world, you woke up and you need to look good on stage, you might want to have this stuff.

Dr. Nayan Patel

That's what I use.

Dave Asprey

So it's time to start taking care of your skin and looking as young as you feel.

It's a small habit.

Big results. Which is why I like it. Go to calderalab.com Dave get 20% off your first order. That's calderalab.com Dave

so you said no glutathione product gets absorbed at all. There has to be some 20% absorption or something.

Dr. Nayan Patel

Zero.

Dave Asprey

Not even the liposomes. None of them are absorbed. They're all broken down, so.

Dr. Nayan Patel

All broken down. So There was a 2011 study done. This was on six. It was in Austin. Was done in Austin at the University of Texas. And there were 26 kids. This was autistic kids. They were given all oral liposome, glutathione, and zero absorption. All the amino acids went up.

Dave Asprey

Absorption into what? Into the bloodstream?

Dr. Nayan Patel

Yeah.

Dave Asprey

Okay. So they measured directly for glutathione.

Dr. Nayan Patel

They measured glutathione, but they also measured all the meat amino acids. They saw a rise of all the cysteines and the glycines and glutamine. And then once it saw the rise, six hours later, they saw a rise of glutathione.

Dave Asprey

Okay.

Dr. Nayan Patel

So what was happening, the conclusion was that the amino acids were actually. The glutathione was actually broken into amino acids. Amino acids was what's getting absorbed, and that's actually is being what's used to produce glutathione. Same thing happened with IVs 30 years ago, 40 years ago, 1991. IV pushes, 0 absorption, 100 was broken into amino acids, and the amino acids was. Was increasing in the blood. And that's what. That's what was the conclusion of getting the glutanine.

Dave Asprey

Even IVs just turned into amino acids in the blood.

Dr. Nayan Patel

Amino acids in the blood.

Dave Asprey

That's crazy. I do feel better after. You do. I mean, it's noticeable.

Dr. Nayan Patel

Well, the 15 minutes, there's a. There's a direct push right now, right?

Dave Asprey

Yeah.

Dr. Nayan Patel

And then there's six hours later, there's a second spike that kicks in because the cysteine gets into the blood, and that's been used to produce glutathione.

Dave Asprey

Wow. And your bypass that you've proved with lab testing, that when you spray it using the oral wellness tech, that it's going directly into the cells and increasing the level.

Dr. Nayan Patel

And what we did was we just didn't test the blood levels by itself. We also test the oxidative stress markers, which is MDA levels, and those went down within the first hour.

Dave Asprey

Okay.

Dr. Nayan Patel

We also measured all the cytokines, because what we did was I said, wait a second, if glutathione gets into to the bloodstream, the results should be immediate. Right. If I give you money right now, you can literally spend the money right now if you want to. Right. So you should Be able to measure the results immediately. And so what the professors at the university did was they took the blood out, they spiked the blood with mycobacterium infection. There's no cure for mycobacterium. And so within hours what they saw was the rise of all the inflammatory markers, the IL2, the IL12, interferon gamma, TNF alpha, all the infertility markers went up and within one hour they saw a drop in the mycobacterium load in the test tube.

Dave Asprey

Wow.

Dr. Nayan Patel

So this is all from within one hour that's incorporated.

Dave Asprey

You said there's no cure for this is mycobacterium.

Podcast Announcer

Yeah.

Dave Asprey

So has someone told Fauci? Because he's looking for things that aren't cures. Just saying, Fauci, we know what you're doing.

Dr. Nayan Patel

Well, when people have hiv, the number one cause of death is mycobacterium infections.

Dave Asprey

And well, I don't know, but if you go back to the 80s, there was 300,000 people where the cause of death was Fauci.

Evil is as evil does.

But to get off my little. That's not even political, that's just like evil bandwagon.

Dr. Nayan Patel

But

Dave Asprey

what I do think is important though is that there might not be a cure for it. But you're showing that getting glutathione in reduced the load, so at least there's a treatment for it, even if it isn't a full on cure.

Dr. Nayan Patel

So what I'm saying is that your body has an innate ability to fix its own problems. And as long as you have enough of the raw materials like the glutathione is there to trigger inflammatory markers, to trigger the natural killer cell activities. All it's doing is that, hey, if I can reduce oxidative stress down, the body will does the rest of the work on its own. You don't need, we don't need a storyteller and a vaccine form of a peptide form to tell your body what to do next.

Dave Asprey

Right?

Dr. Nayan Patel

It can do on its own, provided it can remove this oxid stress markers out of the system. So that's what we found out.

Dave Asprey

There's three things that oftentimes make people feel like crap. There's toxic mold, there's heavy metals. And then there's the other one that we don't talk about as much called LPS or lipopolysaccharides. These are bacterial toxins made in the gut or sometimes in the sinuses that cause massive inflammation. What does glutathione have to do with

Dr. Nayan Patel

each of those directly. Very little.

Dave Asprey

Do tell.

Dr. Nayan Patel

So I just want to make sure people understand that glutathione is not this panacea that cures every single thing. Because it's been labeled that way.

Dave Asprey

Exactly.

Dr. Nayan Patel

That it's a cure all for all. And in reality, it is not. Right. So glutathione is programmed. As of right now, we only two things that it does very, very good. Good. One, it quenches all the free radicals and oxides itself by doing so. And the second part is that it. It uses conjugate. It helps in conjugation pathways in the liver. All the CYP enzyme pathways with the. The Sarcome P450 enzyme pathways. Conjugations and elimination of chemical in those. Can it help with a little bit of mold? Maybe, maybe. But that's not the primary function. It's mostly for chemicals. Conjugation with the chemicals and doing so. But what happens is, though, that's like the number one, number two job in the whole body. When those two things are taking care of it, all of a sudden the oxidative stress burden goes down. And if there's any infections going on, the body is actually able to produce the cytokines to go fight it. And we saw that with our study. Like when we give glutathione, it restocks the stress markers down. And even if we infect the blood with mycobacterium, it right away produce all the cytokines to go fight the problem. Glutan did not do that. Gluten only did the oxygen stress reduction. The body responded better to it right away by. By making sure to get rid of all the side, all this exposure to all these chemicals to you.

Dave Asprey

Cool. What I've seen, I've gone pretty deep on gothin because, you know, maybe 12 years ago, I formulated an advanced product, not nearly as advanced as Oro, but there's. There's a couple of compounds that I, I think glutathione does work with. And you cannot say glutathione stops heavy metals because there are about a dozen heavy metals that we really pay attention to. But there is pretty good evidence for mercury, but not so much for lead. And it doesn't do anything for cadmium, if I remember right, or aluminum. And so different metals are excreted by different pathways. And then if you look at the table of mold toxins, Dr. Neil Nathan, who's just an incredibly brilliant guy, was on the show and he says, well, these four dangerous mycotoxins are excreted via the glutathione pathways. These other ones doesn't affect them at all. So some mold and some metals respond directly to the excretion pathways in the liver that glutathione promotes. But all of them benefit because glutathione reduces reactive oxygen species. So the body can do a better job of getting rid of all the crap via other. Exactly.

Dr. Nayan Patel

Now for all disclosure. My cannulas are very high because I was driving electric car. I'm not going to mention the trailer guy's name. I was driving a very all electric car for 11 years.

Dave Asprey

Yeah.

Dr. Nayan Patel

And my cabin levels are very high.

Dave Asprey

You think that caused your cadmium?

Dr. Nayan Patel

I don't know, but that's what I was told. That's one of the doctors I went to see in San Diego.

Dave Asprey

There's no cadmium dust in an electric

Dr. Nayan Patel

car I don't like.

Dave Asprey

Nonsense. Yeah, but anyway, sniffing the battery plant might be a problem.

Dr. Nayan Patel

Maybe. But anyways, my chemical levels, that's the only thing that was high enough.

Dave Asprey

Chocolate. Chocolate.

Dr. Nayan Patel

I don't.

Dave Asprey

Okay. That's a very large source of cadmium. Okay.

Dr. Nayan Patel

Yes. I don't. So anyway, so that was the only thing that was high. But yeah, I've been using glutathione for six years plus and so that was not reduced by glutathione. We did a study with heavy metal toxicities and we saw quite a few chemicals went down, especially mercury, aluminum a little bit. That's why it helped with.

Dave Asprey

You did see aluminum go down with glutathione? That's the first I heard of that.

Dr. Nayan Patel

Okay, so aluminum went down. So we did see a. A little bit of neurocognition effects on those as well. But not lead, not arsenic. Arsenic was very minimum as well. So yeah, it's not all. It's not all mercury for sure, because mercury we have. Actually we have case studies and I can't mention people's name over here, but they had mercury poison. They are very well known people you'll know.

Dave Asprey

Probably one who ate a lot of swordfish.

Dr. Nayan Patel

What are a lot of swordfish? Yes, big guy. But anyways, I can't say names. But anyways.

Dave Asprey

So it's well known.

Dr. Nayan Patel

Yeah, yeah. But the thing is, 18 months, the mercury came down good. Completely. So.

Dave Asprey

So it definitely can come down. And if you're listening to this, you have high mercury. You really ought to do something about that. It. It has all kinds of bad effects on you. Let's talk about alcohol.

Dr. Nayan Patel

Oh my goodness.

Dave Asprey

In my first year of, of starting the biohacking movement, one of My most popular posts was the alcohol infographic. It's still on DaveAsper.com somewhere. And it's like, hey, here's alcohols that are cleanest. Here's the ones that cause the most hangovers. Here's what's due before, during and after drinking to not get a hangover. And what do you think I had them do before and after drinking Glutathione preload and post load.

Dr. Nayan Patel

Post load, yeah.

Dave Asprey

But that was oral glutathione. And we just found out that doesn't do much except for amino acids. How does the oral wellness topical glutathione work when you're drinking?

Dr. Nayan Patel

So first of all, alcohol can actually deplete the gluten levels to zero for the next two to three hours minimum. Yeah, you don't want to take it

Dave Asprey

with Tylenol to really double down on it.

Dr. Nayan Patel

Double down to kill yourself.

Dave Asprey

Tylenol will also do that together. Liver damage.

Dr. Nayan Patel

Yeah. So right away it's a fast way to go to heaven, right? Exactly. So I don't drink alcohol anymore, but when I used to drink alcohol, this was when I was last week, right? Maybe. Well, usually I used to go with my buddies on the golf trips. Oh, yeah. So those five days I was just bad for you. But anyway, so what we all did, and it was just not myself. We all did the same thing. Before we go out drinking, which is usually two or three drinks for the night, we'll load up our glutathione and it's usually about 2 to 300 milligrams, which is about 8 to 12 sprays off the gluteril. And before we drink, the alcohol gets processed by glutathione immediately. So you're buzzing right away. But if you do a breathalyzer, and we have done this plenty time, it shows zero. I know.

Dave Asprey

So if you spray gluterol before you drink, there's no alcohol in your breath.

Dr. Nayan Patel

There's no alcohol in the breath. You're still buzzing because everything is still processing because the brain is acetaldehyde. It's the neurotoxic chemical. So the liver is processing the alcohol really, really fast. And then most guys, what I'll do is if you're gonna have more than three drinks, which I. I tell should not do that anyways, but you have more than three drinks, then after the drinking, apply another 10 to 12 sprays. And that way there is no alcohol in the body. Everything is processed. The acetaldehyde is a very short half life. So you're still buzzing, you're still impaired, you can't drive. You're still going to have a heavy head while you're drinking, but when you wake up in the morning, completely fresh.

Dave Asprey

So my updated protocol would be zbiotic. That was episode 1000, our first genetically engineered probiotic, which lowers gut formation of acetaldehyde, which the liver is going to have to get rid of. And then the other 20% of alcohol is metabolized in liver to acetaldehyde. And if you use the RO topical glutathione spray, well, then the liver can better handle all of that and you'll still get buzzed, but you don't take the hit nearly as much. And I'm not advising you to drink. It's not that good for you. My rule is I'll drink it if it's older than me. And I'm talking about calendar age, not biological age. So it's going to be really expensive. I very rare. Like once a year I'll have a drink of something really special. It's just, it's not worth, not worth it. But that's the protocol I would follow. But I did not know about spraying RO Wellness, the glutathione. So I will add that to my

Dr. Nayan Patel

protocol because that's so Dave, you know, I launched a company with just glutathione for helping people with drinking. It's called Drinker's Best Friend.

Dave Asprey

That was you. I didn't know that you were a drinker's best friend.

Dr. Nayan Patel

I, I, you lush.

Dave Asprey

I didn't know. You seemed so innocent.

Dr. Nayan Patel

Well, thing is, it went against all I do, right?

Dave Asprey

It really does.

Dr. Nayan Patel

I, I said, I don't want to be associated with that. I said, I want to help people stop drinking. And I was convinced, convinced that drinking is a mental issue. It's not a physical issue. And so I said, I want to help people and said I thought I was doing good today. If I cannot fix you mentally because you're having some help right now, at least I can help you physically to stay alive. And so that's why I launched a product. But I found out that most people, they don't get it, and so they wanted. So a year and a half ago, I said, you know what? I'm going to sunset this, that product completely. It was away from what I was trying to do anyways, but it worked.

Dave Asprey

I feel you. And that's why I put out the infographic. I'm not promoting drinking. I'm promoting drinking is very bad for you, but you might do it anyway. Because community is good for you and people just do it and same thing, most of the preventative stuff. No one goes out planning to get shitty drunk. No, they plan to have a drink or two and then six drinks later, you know, they're falling asleep on their front porch or something and they wake up feeling like crap. So if it's same thing, criminals usually don't plan to get caught, which is why they do such stupid stuff. I'm not going to get caught. And then they do. Right. But criminal knew they were likely to get caught. They might be a better criminal or they would just choose a better profession. Like maybe working for Fauci. So I don't know, I'm just on Fauci. I don't know.

Dr. Nayan Patel

Well, Dave, in that sense, if you know that you're mortal.

Dave Asprey

Yeah.

Dr. Nayan Patel

How would you do different things? Things today. Today.

Dave Asprey

But I am immortal.

Dr. Nayan Patel

Huh?

Dave Asprey

I am immortal.

Dr. Nayan Patel

You are immortal.

Dave Asprey

Right now you're Indian. Past life.

Dr. Nayan Patel

We're past life. But this physical body is mortal. So how do you.

Dave Asprey

Are we sure that it's not?

Dr. Nayan Patel

I don't know what happens. I'll find out, but.

Dave Asprey

Or you might not. If a bus hits you, you might not know it. All right.

Dr. Nayan Patel

Yeah. So anyway, so would you do things differently? Right. So that was always a question that I guess asked myself.

Dave Asprey

This gets into a little bit of philosophy, but, oh, maybe 10 plus years ago. I've studied all the different perspectives, shamanism and Eastern philosophies. And the only rational thing I can think of is to believe in reincarnation. And this works even if you're Christian. Okay. Go to heaven and maybe come back from heaven, I don't know. You got to figure that one out. But the reason to believe in reincarnation is that you'll just be less afraid of dying. So you'll be less fearful in life and you'll be nicer to other people and you might take, that's it. Worthy risks. So if you're wrong, you won't know. That's right. If you choose to believe in reincarnation and then you're a good person because you're going to have to clean up your mess in the next life, you'll still go to heaven if that's the way.

Podcast Announcer

Right.

Dave Asprey

Because you were a good person. Right. But if you believe in nihilism and that this is my only shot, I got to take everything for myself. Well, you probably won't go to heaven and your next life will probably be not as good. So just truth table Computer science philosophy Believe in Reincarnation, whether it's real or not, it doesn't matter, right? Because it makes life easier and better and it supports all the different belief systems I can think of. Does glutathione give you extra past lives?

Dr. Nayan Patel

If you're buying this product? Yes, it does. Not really. Yeah, buy the product just for that.

Dave Asprey

You tapped into massive influencer level there, man. So I do, though, things think with, with alcohol, the. The evidence is in. It's just not good for you. And levels are plummeting. And here's what's interesting. Levels started plummeting with young people already just because they realize this is not cool. And kudos if you're. You're one of the early adopters. But then over the last three, four years, GLP1s have created anhedonia, which is inability to experience joy. And they drive a strong decrease in alcohol, in overeating, and even in gambling. So casinos and alcohol manufacturers are just emptying out. And it's a big change in society. I'm not sure that that's necessarily good for us. I don't really think gambling or alcohol stores are good for you. But along with that, people's inability to experience orgasm and their libidos are going away. So I'm a fan of microdosing GLP1s for longevity, and I'm a fan of using whatever you need to get thin as long as you eat protein and exercise and do all the other stuff. So then you can go off of it. Because being in a world where I have no desire, you won't have desire to take care of yourself either. And then you won't take your glutathione, you won't put butter in your coffee, all the things you're supposed to do.

Dr. Nayan Patel

So, you know, I do with all the peptides, so glutamine peptides. So like even the GLP ones, I do make into nasal spray from using the same technology.

Dave Asprey

Oh, that's interesting. Yeah, I want it.

Dr. Nayan Patel

How do I try this for the pharmacy?

Dave Asprey

You're a pharmacist. Hook your brother up.

Dr. Nayan Patel

Yeah, of course I will hook you up, but you know, it is. So I'm dabbling with all the peptides that are out there right now. But again, you're right, microdosing is the way to go, because suppressing is not the answer. Because suppressing means you're suppressing all desires and what desire you're really suppressing. Not desire to eat sugars, you're suppressing desire to eat salads and the healthy food. So people that are on a GLP1S. They're very unhealthy to begin with. They're losing weight, but they're unhealthy to begin with. And now the oxidative stress is going really, really high. All the people on GLP1, every one of them at my pharmacy, guess what? They're on glutathione. And that's the only reason why they still have energy, otherwise they'll be lacking.

Dave Asprey

They put the GLP one in glutathione

Dr. Nayan Patel

so that it's like two separate prescriptions. One prescription is just for tirzepatide or the GLP1s. And over the counter I give them the glutathione as they combine them together because it helps reduce the oxidress markers even in the gut because now they have too much sug. They're losing weight, but they're not healthy weight.

Dave Asprey

Wow, okay, that's interesting. Is there any effect from glutathione on muscle mass, on bodybuilding, things like that?

Dr. Nayan Patel

No, it does not have anything like that because that there's two things that happen with GLP one, one is hair loss and two is muscle wasting. That's the number one, number two reason with glp. One, either one of them is not gluten. Cannot help help either one of them. The third issue, the third issue is oxid stress is increasing to the very, very high level for the organ. That's why people are having organ failures in sometimes some cases. And that's where it affects that we don't hear those cases because guess what? Those are usually end up in the hospital or doctor sees those cases in the public. They don't talk about those kinds of things.

Dave Asprey

Nan, I picture you at the Aura Wellness Labs and you've got like a mad hatter hat on and you've got this big counter full of all these chemicals and compounds. And you're kind of like, what can I do next? Like a kid in a candy store, like putting stuff together. And you have that energy too of like, look at all this cool stuff we can do. What is next on the list? Like what's the next big thing after GLP wants?

Dr. Nayan Patel

If you look back at the history, history is talking about 50 years ago, 1977, we introduced a product called Tagamet, which is an H2 blocker for acid reflux disease. And we, we thought that the ulcers was caused by too much of acid. And so we started giving everybody antacids. And then 30, 40 years later, we found out that the ulcers are caused by bacteria, not by acid. Oopsie. Oopsie. But guess what? We never stopped taking the drugs. So even today's date, the number one selling drugs are all something to do with stomach acid reflux disease. So Tagum and Zantex and Pepcids and Prilosex and Nexium. I'm giving all the brand names, I'm so sorry about those because people don't understand generic names. But anyway, so these medications have actually depleted all of our gut gastric acids. So we have digestive issues for the last 30, 40 years. We have hair loss issues because of that. We have all this, by the way, all the, the tides are also made in the gut. Right. And so if you're going to make all this, all those amino acids are conjugated inside your gut, we having a massive, massive disruption in this, this amount of how much tides we have in the body.

Dave Asprey

Wow.

Dr. Nayan Patel

And so my thing is that I want to identify some of those things and see which one are causing. Right now the big One is the 157. It's a huge one that's out there. I'm still studying that portion out to see if that. I did go to FDA to see if I can do an IND application. So I'll do things legally of course and see figure that portion out. So the FDA gave me a 15 page letter saying oh, there's no proven thing. So I have to do animal studies and safety studies and all those things. So we are working with around those right now as we speak. But our goal is to look at that information and see if can I, I can bring this to the marketplace or study them right now. So I'm working on all these different gut produced peptides right now is what I'm looking at right now.

Dave Asprey

Okay, yeah, that would make so much sense. And yeah, the whole idea that we need the government to tell us something is safe. It's just time to end that. Their track record is horrendous. Absolutely horrendous. Agent Orange, anybody? And it just goes on from there. And then they approve Alzheimer's drugs that don't work in their own trials because it's political, politically expedient. So to me, the government saying something

works doesn't mean anything.

It's like saying someone paid to tell us it works. So that means just by basic human logic that they should be advisory, not regulatory.

Dr. Nayan Patel

True.

Dave Asprey

Right. And that your doctor and your pharmacist should be the ones who are saying, well here's what it does. And then you make an informed decision with everything we know. I'm hoping that that shifts in the US because if it doesn't, you know what's going to happen, happen. Well, I'll just go to other countries and get whatever we want and then come back just like I do today.

Dr. Nayan Patel

Yeah, well, that's unfortunate, but I'd rather get into things over here. It's much more safer.

Dave Asprey

You're doing the work. Right. But I think they're making you do extra work because if BPC157 was massively dangerous, we would see a big signal. And now they're saying you have to go back even though it's been used and studied for 20 years, saying no, you have to multiple studies. They're just delaying it because it probably competes with some other drug. So it's okay to put something out and say we're not sure if this works. Take it your own risk. Thank you. That was my risk, not yours. So you don't get to allocate it for me. That's why I choose danger. Hey.

Dr. Nayan Patel

Yeah. But the thing is, right now the issue is not just using this product is to getting the high grade materials is the hard part.

Dave Asprey

Yeah. The grid market's scary.

Dr. Nayan Patel

Yeah. Because you're getting research grade material which is not the highest grade. So personally I would prefer to use a higher grade material.

Dave Asprey

Me too.

Dr. Nayan Patel

And so I had to go back to the manufacturers and say, hey, give me a higher grade material. Say, oh, we cannot legally make this product. And so that's another concerns I have. But, but there's a.

Dave Asprey

So you can't compound.

Dr. Nayan Patel

I do, I do. So we go to Sigma, which is the, which is the government company and we buy from them the research grade. But which is the highest grade material. We pay a lot of money for that part, but that's the only product we can use for or if you do FDA trials.

Dave Asprey

So then you know what you're getting. Okay.

Dr. Nayan Patel

Yep.

Dave Asprey

That makes so much sense. Well, thanks for doing the hard work. And guys, it's RO Wellness A U R O wellness dot com. Dave, save some money. And I'm serious. Try the glutathione. Maybe try some of the facial stuff too. The glutathione part that goes on the face with vitamin C is really good. And just do it for a month and see the difference because getting glutathione into your cells is a different experience. Experience. And my friend, it's, it's always fun to hang out and just to hear what you're up to. So thanks for coming back to Austin.

Dr. Nayan Patel

Thank you so much.

Dave Asprey

See you next time on the Human Upgrade Podcast.

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